alright guys. i know your going WTH.. BAN HIM!!!
since the addition of the map i've been looking constantly at the minimap, even while walking around! even better with motion tracking,

it really sucks now to rely on your map... I feel like a mobile comm shouting orders like ALIEN incoming! comm Drop This! comm do this.. Oh WTH..

and plus now im just using the minimap on maps that i don't know.. instead of walking around and getting to know the map.

I know that noobs need the map to get around.. but i've seen ppl walking into walls lately.. and they go on for a few seconds before they realize that ther is a wall there...


Get rid of map!

for noobs, just tell them to follow you around!

Just make it a corridor 7 style MINIATURE minimap in the top right corner

make it cover an area a little bigger than it is now, and it'd be perfect

erm.. okay your idea works too! just get rid of the bigger map

I like the map. I think that it's necessary, with NS' complicated maps and vent systems and the large variety of maps. Plus it's difficult to coordinate and use teamwork if you can't tell people where to go on the map.

This could be an interesting suggestion. The marines should be following waypoints, so I don't think a map is really needed. Even if the marines were confused, they could and should rely on the com for direction.

+1 to teamwork

The aliens have hivesight, but no clear way to get around... Just a thought, but maybe give some aliens maps like gorges to make them have a bigger role? That would be probable since if the gorge is not healing or building, most of the time it's sitting around, waiting for res.

To be honest i dont think ive looked at the map since the day it was added, i like to get lost and fumble around the map makes for an intresting game playing experiance.

Id say remove the minimap, leave the big map, lose MT and SOF. Would give the game a much better atmospehere.

Good suggestion.

I think the minimap is essential for new players and should stay but some of its features need to be turned off.

I say Get rid of MT in the minimap for all but commander and I say get rid of the fact that what your allies see appears on minimap (scan is ok but not what your allies see).

I use the map to

1: See where my other team mates are and how they are getting on.
2: Heavily use it to see where alien movements are with MT.
3: To learn levels and the locations of vents are
4: Spot aliens in dark corners or on ceilings (if your looking they'll show up on the map)

I do not see how someone can walk straight into a wall when the MAP is showing exactly where they walking and the location of the walls they are supposidly walking into.

The only 2 reasons you supplied to me do not convince me for this to be removed, and my own experiances with the map far outweight your reasons.

Your two reasons being

1:I rely on it too much.
2: I've seen people walk into walls recently. (Thats pure conjecture as to wether they were using the map at the time or being stupid and not using the mouse to navigate)

And Comms are WAY to overloaded now with tasks with SC now being the prevailent upgrade chamber "Scan here comm." "Medpack, ammo." "Upgrades, SG@base comm." "Upgrade TF" "PG here comm?" To suddenyl say "We've got aliens going to here, here ,here, here (and thats if you using minimaps with names, I'm sure theres view people out there that play NS that know every locations name from the tiny minimap a comm has on his chair)

And if MT was nerfed so much I would probaly wouldn't research considering all it would be then is a visual aid for telling where aliens are in the immediate vincity. Ears are good enough and looking is even better.

I understand where your are comming from but the map is a useful feature that I've grown to like and for expreienced players or field commanders it is a very useful tool.

Just to let you know my inital reaction was no, but I gave you a fair and unbiased hearing to see if you could win me over and show me why it's a good idea I should support. There are some very stupid gamers out there but development is about a battle with the universe where the programmers try to make better and more robust software while the universe make bigger and better idiots. Granted the universe is winning but that isn't a reason to go removing things, if anything you add something. That's like saying because there's one guy in the construction company who can't hammer a nail that you should remove the hammers for everyone? No no.

vote no

I want the map to be removed, not because im a noob hater, but because of this..

Cuz.. its just not fair.. especially for the aliens.. lets say a lone marine with motion can go and set up rts. While the marine builds he turns up his map and watches for red blips. its just not fair for the alien expecting a snack. When your building your suppose to have teamates covering you, not a rambo. And as a marine, ive used the Map to ninja in phasegats, its just plain easy, turn on the map and wait for the skulks to pass by.

anyways Its the comm thats supposed to have the big picture of everything, NOT the marine. The comm is suppose to be your guide, not the MAP.

I don't want the map removed, but I do see improvements. For one, the map moves instead of you moving on the map, to give a more realistic feeling i guess...

uhh.... its already in their, in your top right side of your HUD.

OMG... DID WE forget all about that map?

I use the map sometimes if I'm not quite sure about some vents and so on. but mainly I know where to go. I like the map, but the problem is that newbees mostly skip over the "showmap" key when they configure their settings in the options menu. maybe that's the point most players who are new to the game don't know what or where a wall is and so on

we already have a map.. its on the top-right hand corner of ur HUD, why was their another map added? it basically made the other map useless.

Maybe the minimap but the large map is a valuable tool and not an annoyance or anything like that.

If you are looking at the minimap all the time then you are missing the chances to pistol whip that barely visable skulk.

The big map is good because you can see what your team mates see and respond accordingly. EX: fade goes in a room, bring up the map, see how many guys are in there. and their locations in the room, fade blinks out, you might rush in depending on the above information and what you heard.

Map isn't noob. That's just plain smart. Smart = non-nub

Lastly, MT and the map works really really well. It is not "newb" to see a RT tower is under attack and make a detour. The commander could be very tied up. Plus, MT is balanced under the idea that marines are going to have their maps up and that they can see the aliens. No map means MT needs to be rebalanced (less res and time since it is no where near effective anymore.)

Marines without maps have no strategic input. They don't know what to do to help out their team, so the comm has to dictate everything, like Yash said.

If you comm on servers where people know what they're doing, you'll know that it's nice to be a comm when the marines automatically go to uncapped res nodes and cap them for you. You'll know that it's nice when the marines see a phase gate under attack and automatically phase over there. You'll know how nice it is to be able to focus on a long term goal rather than having to order the marines everywhere.

The map is good for one other thing. When you join a server midgame you can instantly get a good picture of whats going on. This goes for both alien and marine. I don´t use the map that much, but I use it after every resolved combat to see how the state of things have changed.

I think the map is one of the best additions to NS in general. Teamwork actually works now.

And speaking as a commander, if the marines can figure out where to go and not go by themselfes, then I can concentrate on planning ahead for an assult or a techup. Sure I still give waypoints and tell them where to go but I don´t have to micromanage them to every free node.

The minimap is a very useful tool, and on new maps, it makes the game go faster instead of EVERYONE fumbling around trying to find the hive or what not.

And it reduces the strain on the commander, which is already heavy.

And if marines go early MT, that means they are easy kills (esp. before MT goes up), or they have less nodes, and less structures. So there's your compromise.

But WAIT! What if they combine MT with their OTHER upgrades?!? OMG HAX! Urm, let's put it this way. The USA now has WMDs and a technologically advanced army and superior SIGint to anyone else. Being unmolested on their home ground for a few centuries leaving their infrastructure in tip top condition helped a lot.

Like if the marines had 10 RTs and they were only accessible by a PG.

So in other words, if they can combine MT with other tech, that means the Kharaa gave marines too many nodes. Continuously fighting 0 res marines at area X seems like you are doing something, but you are really doing nothing.

ok my only beef is to have motion tracking removed fro the big over veiw map except in a radius aroud nthe marine, cos when they get motion tracking there no hideing, wel lther eis for me i can wait ill wait for ages, but others dont, and besides that marines have a good memorie, and to me thats just so lame

now i know why ono eggs die a lot

although i do believe in relying on the comm, taking away the mini map would be too much for the comm to handle. and if the gave a waypoint, you couldnt look at the mini map to know where it is. you would have to look 360 degrees for the waypoint. and if you are complaining that you can see your team mates on the mini map, well, so can the aliens. and whatsmore, aliens can see their team mates without using the mini map. they have hivesight.

and the mini map kinda promotes team work. I mean, how would you know if reinforcements were coming if the mini map was taken out? and using the mini map, you could wait for others and actually go as a team.

the mini map is also vital for new players. I mean, how is a new player supposed to navigate through tanith or eclispe without a map? especially if the new player is an alien and trying to figure out the vents. Hell, even I need the map for ns_eon and ns_altair.

just because YOU memorised it doesn't mean EVERYONE did.

i disagree with the idea. the minimap is a very strategic tool for the marines, and prevents people from losing their way. especially in newer maps, since ns maps are very big. the scenario you are talking about now is just when there is MT. even if there isn't a minimap, a marine can still easily predict a skulk's movements. and seriously, do you really think EVERY member of the ns community is that helpful to newbies?

This really isn't the time to be nerfing Marines.

However, I would suggest removing all icons from the popup map, but leave them on the minimap. The popup map is the equivalent of the marine reaching into his pocket and pulling out a map of the level to find out how to get to "Junction 12". The minimap is more like a built-in radar.

As for you guys whining about losing map abilities, Marines don't have maps AT ALL in CO, and they seem to do fine.

erm... thats because CO maps are small?

my personal openion,if you don't want a map,just freaking unbind the key.Thus you don't rely on it.They have it there for a reason.How about we make it so you don't know how many rounds in your magizine,it adds to the tension!...

cos CO is CO. I like my map in NS and FYI what your looking through is a visor which marines can call up info like a map, hence why waypoints appear in thin air and why other marine's health and armour appear when you look at them.

its not the map.. its the big map that makes the smaller map useless.. thats why.

Your right, maps are stupid. I mean who needs to know how many res nodes your team has? Who likes an overview of motion tracking? and most importantly who realy needs to see where your players and the enemy players are? Take out the chair to, that has a map in it.. and remove the hive. Hivesight is pretty darn close to a map.

That would make the game perfect.

erm... i dont get it.. but its just taht the bigger map just made the smaller map useless.. thats why.. i wan't it removed.

If people think "Well lets nerf marines even more so that they almost have to depend on certain coordinated teamwork" then you need to go away. With 3.0 out the marines are stretched thin enough. People yell "Marines should work together!" well that really depends on the commanders ability to rally other people he probably doesnt know to his cause.

Aliens get the ability to work as individuals if they want. They are very flexible, very unique, able to complete tasks alone if they want. Marines, without map, now would be forced into a very tight spot. Aliens dont have to win the hearts and minds of their subjects, marines do. Marine victories are now almost toally based on their ability to work together, and clan marines can do that easily, but a majority of general players and general pros dont really trust whoever leads them at first sight.

Keep the map. Its a marine's deadliest weapon, and that is finding viable points in which to hold position, attack from position, lock down, mine it up, evade position, etc. If people say "Marines should use their BRAINS and not their GUNS!11!1!" well then taking the map would remove the one tactical part from the game that the marines have. I use the map a lot because it helps me gague what is around the surroundings and how to use them to my advantage.

Leave the map, for christs sakes dont bring the marines any lower than you have.

I agree with AUX Recoup. Leave the map in. It is oh so useful for new maps and to get a quick idea about how well the match is going in different locations.

The problem is that marines already have a map on the top right corner of your screen. The large map makes that feature useless, so we might as well take it out so the marines use an intended feature. We never said marines were too strong, we are just looking at the game, function-wise, rather than which team is winning more than the other. I'll have to admit, since the map was introduced, I have never bothered to use the marine minimap.