My under standing of zenocide is that the skulk lets go of control of certain bodily functions resulting in a chemical explosion of skulk innards as a result of a lot f pressure being relised from the skulks body
My idea is simple why not has a sort of scale that would let the skulk still explode even if shot (with less dmg)
Based on 5 second from start to pop
1 sec 10% of normal zeno dmg
2 sec 20% of normal zeno dmg
3 sec 40% of normal zeno dmg
4 sec 60% of normal zeno dmg
5 sec 100% of normal zeno dmg and the normal popping of skulk
This would make it o the skulk would still be able to do dmg (though not as much)
And if u say “but why " ever try and shot a can of spray paint (it pops)
Full Version: Zeno Pops Where Shot
Unknown Worlds Forums > Natural Selection > Natural Selection Discussion > Ideas and Suggestions Forum > Ideas for future versions
So you want basically allow xeno to go off, even if the skulk gets killed during the process.
I vote no, cause the only xeno counter is shooting the skulk down and this would negate it.
I vote no, cause the only xeno counter is shooting the skulk down and this would negate it.
This is obviously a double edged sword.
1) It helps for those Skulks who try to Xenocide turrets and stuff.
2) It helps Marines easily destroy Xenociding skulks from afar. Just take your pistol and pop it.
If I was a dev implementing this kind of idea, I would at least make the skulks explode when they -die-, not get shot with one bullet, but that's just my imagination at work, and it could probably screw up gameplay balance and such. >_>;;
1) It helps for those Skulks who try to Xenocide turrets and stuff.
2) It helps Marines easily destroy Xenociding skulks from afar. Just take your pistol and pop it.
If I was a dev implementing this kind of idea, I would at least make the skulks explode when they -die-, not get shot with one bullet, but that's just my imagination at work, and it could probably screw up gameplay balance and such. >_>;;
Interesting idea...
I'd like to see it take more than 1 pistol round though...
But it's interesting..
I'd like to see it take more than 1 pistol round though...
But it's interesting..
I believe that the Skulk actually consciously releases two seperate chemicals in its body into each other; they mix and create a rather big bang. Claiming it is due to certain bodily functions makes it sound like the Skulk is farting to death, taking many people with it. While this may be perfectly reasonable, I prefer the real explanation. 
| QUOTE |
| Chemical glands crack open and mix in the center of the Skulk's body, foaming and expanding so rapidly that its body explodes. Though the force of the explosion is itself enough to kill even a heavily armored marine, the Skulk's bones are also specially evolved to splinter into tiny shards. |
That'll do.
Now, to the point at hand.
It is unlikely that these chemicals would mix as the Skulk is shot. Yes, it could happen, but it is unlikely. One assumes the Skulk has evolved in such a way as to have said chemicals in secure locations of the anatomy, and probably not next door to each other - wouldn't want any mishaps occurring.
Aside from this, I don't like the idea. Xenocide is a three hive ability - one assumes when the third hive is up, the Kharaa actually evolve this ability. Therefore, it would not even be possible for the Skulk to explode UNLESS all three hives were up and running.
And now, as I go back to read your post again, I realise I'm not sure what I'm writing about, and not entirely sure what you were either. Thank you, and good night.
EDIT: You want them to explode even when they've died? The chemicals would not have fully mixed in time! Hah, my drivel concerning the actual way Xenocide works DID help!
>_>
I already suggested this and people argued it would be to powerfull if a skulk still explode when killed before explode
I already suggested this and people argued it would be to powerfull if a skulk still explode when killed before explode
Bad idea. Xeno would be insanely powerful. Every ability in the game has a strength and weakness. Xeno's weakness is that the skulk is fragile. Thus, the counter for Xeno is to kill the skulk. If you remove the counter, then you remove the weakness. In combat, everyone would just go superskulk. You would have 5 xeno's exploding in a row with no way to stop them.
| QUOTE (RobB @ Oct 25 2004, 05:41 PM) |
| >_> I already suggested this and people argued it would be to powerfull if a skulk still explode when killed before explode |
People were right!
ok basically when u use zenocide there is a waiting period (that seams to take for ever) before he pops my idea is simply to make a smaller bang but still have it happen as in the above mentioned article I did when shot though it wouldn’t be able to kill a full hp marine it would still dmg him (and this is a hive 3 ability so it should be pumped)
I agree with those who said this would make Xenocide even more powerful. Xenocide right now is overpowered as it is, though it should be that way in classic, for combat a change is needed. Buffing xenocide like this doesn't help with the balance at all. Right now, atleast it takes some sort of timing skill to get off a good xenocide. If you add this, then all the skulk has to do is just xenoing whenever he wants and jump at the marines because even if he dies, he still hurts them, it takes out any sort of skill necessary to xenocide.
If you find that you are dying too much before xenociding, just work on your timing, and you MUST use leap in combination with xenociding or you will usually die before achieving your goal.
If you find that you are dying too much before xenociding, just work on your timing, and you MUST use leap in combination with xenociding or you will usually die before achieving your goal.
dude its called resuply if a marines not instantly killed, the com ( in co ) gives him a med in like 2 secs so i dont see the prob
| QUOTE (Mchief @ Oct 25 2004, 07:46 PM) |
| ok basically when u use zenocide there is a waiting period (that seams to take for ever) before he pops my idea is simply to make a smaller bang but still have it happen as in the above mentioned article I did when shot though it wouldn’t be able to kill a full hp marine it would still dmg him (and this is a hive 3 ability so it should be pumped) |
same as mine
How about the more you hold down the xeno attack the more damage it does, up to the current maximum
'nother idea: If you are shot before xeno blows you up, you emit a spore or umbra cloud, duration is longer the more complete the xeno cycle was.
| QUOTE (Faskalia @ Oct 25 2004, 12:33 PM) |
| So you want basically allow xeno to go off, even if the skulk gets killed during the process. I vote no, cause the only xeno counter is shooting the skulk down and this would negate it. |
Besides gameplay reasons why not, also remember that the electric charge require first a large inhale for the rapid cellar metabolism required to charge up the capacitor like organelles in the fat cells.
(the plus sign signals when xenocide detonates, the point of no stopping)
current:
|--------------------------------------------+|
your suggestion:
|+--------------------------------------------|
still bad:
|--------------------------+------------------|
what I'd agree to:
|-------------------------------------------+-|
Zunni refresh my memory... How long exactly is the Xenocide warmup?
doesnt make sense in my opinion. once the skulks body pressure inside reaches a certain point (after the scream) it blows. anything before that wont blow.
so lets say they died mid xeno, if the chemical reactions stopped it wouldnt blow.
if the chemical reactions kept going ti would do full damage anyway. but yeah its a game.
so lets say they died mid xeno, if the chemical reactions stopped it wouldnt blow.
if the chemical reactions kept going ti would do full damage anyway. but yeah its a game.
Bad idea. A good skulk can already time a xenocide so that he can have it warming up and leap in with just enough time to land in a group of marines at the same instant that he blows. Making it so that once you trigger it you always manage to blow up is way overpowering. Might as well make it blow up the instant you hit the key if that's the method you want to use. Since at late game xeno is much more useful for stripping armor than actually killing, taking it down even to 60% damage won't change that. 120 damage vs. an armor 3 marine still takes their armor down low enough to make them killable in two attacks or one focus attack.
The warm up makes xeno interesting, keep it as it is.
The warm up makes xeno interesting, keep it as it is.
i think this is a good idea, but the skulk's health would/could scale accordingly, so you start xenoing, hp decreases rapidly, then you explode. the moment you explode, your hp reaches 1. 1 second into xeno'ing you hp is around 80% of normal... ect..
basically hp gets turned into energy of the blast.
basically hp gets turned into energy of the blast.
The main question people should be asking themselves is this:
At its current state, is Xeno lacking in power that it really needs a buff like this?
Answer: No. And it's not an opinionated answer either, it's backed by evidence on numerous servers, combat and classic. On combat, Xenocide is already overpowered the way it is, hopefully there will be a buff to Xenocide in combat, which either comes in that its much more expensive to upgrade to xenocide or something else. In classic, the aliens already have 3 hives and most likely higher lifeforms so skulks that xeno are pure offensive support units, that can deal deadly damage to the marines, especially their armor.
Now, if this buff was implemented, in order to maintain balance, Xeno damage overall would have to be killed by 50%, or the marines will get owned every single time since xeno can't fail now. This will screw over the players who have gotten the xeno timing down perfectly, making them angry. In conclusion, interesting but bad idea.
At its current state, is Xeno lacking in power that it really needs a buff like this?
Answer: No. And it's not an opinionated answer either, it's backed by evidence on numerous servers, combat and classic. On combat, Xenocide is already overpowered the way it is, hopefully there will be a buff to Xenocide in combat, which either comes in that its much more expensive to upgrade to xenocide or something else. In classic, the aliens already have 3 hives and most likely higher lifeforms so skulks that xeno are pure offensive support units, that can deal deadly damage to the marines, especially their armor.
Now, if this buff was implemented, in order to maintain balance, Xeno damage overall would have to be killed by 50%, or the marines will get owned every single time since xeno can't fail now. This will screw over the players who have gotten the xeno timing down perfectly, making them angry. In conclusion, interesting but bad idea.
I totally agree. xeno would need damage scaling down big time.
Xeno is over powered for CO but in NS its prefectly fine... Xeno is a last ditch attempt at stopping marines from seiging one of your hives in a ninja rush and you've foolishly lost your fades and lerks cos they got a bit too lax about watching their health.
Although i've only ever seen it on a seige map xenos are good for killing a marine team trying to ninja seige.
Although i've only ever seen it on a seige map xenos are good for killing a marine team trying to ninja seige.
| QUOTE (Taaketa @ Oct 28 2004, 05:35 PM) |
| Xeno is over powered for CO but in NS its prefectly fine... |
Sounds perfect then.
PS: Combat and seige maps don't count.
And Xenocide could use a boost.
I would think you could allow xeno to reduce/elimainate armour as a balance for this.
The problem that everyone is fizated upon is the effect on the marines, but if the skulks can be killed more easilly, its possible to mitagate the effects of xenocide a bit by stopping them mid-way through.
If the skulks are weakened a bit it could be used as a bit of a nerf, xenocides tend to do less damage agianst an aware group of marines as they can stop it mid-through the explosion.
the fact that a skilled skulk can time it right and get a good leap and xeno in is a perfectly fine thing, but the fact that a toatal noob can do exactly the same damage with relativly little skill needs to be fixed in my opinion.
I do believe however that the damage done by the interupted xeno should be about 50% of its status, so blowing up at 50% completion would do 25% of the damage.
The problem that everyone is fizated upon is the effect on the marines, but if the skulks can be killed more easilly, its possible to mitagate the effects of xenocide a bit by stopping them mid-way through.
If the skulks are weakened a bit it could be used as a bit of a nerf, xenocides tend to do less damage agianst an aware group of marines as they can stop it mid-through the explosion.
the fact that a skilled skulk can time it right and get a good leap and xeno in is a perfectly fine thing, but the fact that a toatal noob can do exactly the same damage with relativly little skill needs to be fixed in my opinion.
I do believe however that the damage done by the interupted xeno should be about 50% of its status, so blowing up at 50% completion would do 25% of the damage.
If you all read the post... you'd realize that popping the skulk would GREATLY reduce the damage dealt...
I think xeno is fine the way it is, I wouldn't change a thing with how it works.
| QUOTE (BulletHead @ Oct 28 2004, 10:54 PM) |
| If you all read the post... you'd realize that popping the skulk would GREATLY reduce the damage dealt... |
Ah, but reading the whole thread will show arguments that take this into consideration.
3:30 am... dun mess with me
I still think this should be considered
I still think this should be considered
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