Just a simple idea, for 10 res you can upgrade any available upgrade till the end of game, even after you die, unless all buildings of that one upgrade are destroyed.

Gestating time could be long like lerking...

I think it would give spawning skulks what they need to counter spawn killing a bit.

If not 10 res, 20...

Not a bad idea. I might pay 20 or 30 res for a constant celerity cara. This is a good solution to the uselessness of getting upgrades as a skulk.

I don't play NS mode a lot but that is definitely a good idea. Having to spend time & rescources to get all my upgrades back is very, very annoying. In fact it's one of the reasons why I don't play NS mode.

i dont like it. spawn camping is one of the only ways to keep aliens contained and by doing this ur taking that away

hmm...this might be worth it. However, only skulks have this option. And it shouldn't last forever. If you pay 10 res all at once, maybe you get the upgrade the next 6 times or something.

well, i dunno. i guess it would be good if your going perma-something, but if you wanna switch classes, people usually pick different upgrades depending on what class they are.

its actually a pretty good idea, i just dont know as if that many people would make use of it.

wee, i like

It should be permanent for the class it has been purchased with though and should be available again even after switching to another class: A skulk buys the perma up, goes gorge and loses it, but as soon as he's a skulk again he gets his up back.

only thing I'd say is make it also then that you can also pick another upgrade (against the same rescost) even though you are upgraded already.

So if you got tired of cara, you get regen.

only a small thought:

6vs6 ;1 goes gorge and places an sc, the rest gets perma-focus= gg marines

With perma-upgraded skulks you could end the average game in 60 seconds.

It is a bit overpowered and should be only available after the second hive went up.

yea... 1 guy is gonna "just kill the hive" or seige and pump it by himself. sorry tbh but when 3/4 of the team is dead the last thing u want to do is to waste ur ammo or to build something that will never go up or down(depending on what ur doing). hence why i mentioned the word CONTAINED? meaning while a marine spawn camps, the rest of ur team can concentrate on nodes.

edit btw. what the HELL is with all this armor one crap. have none of you heard of LERK SPORES? armor1 isnt a great counter to focus, either you are playing against noob skulks, the alien team decides to drop no sensories at all or you have some killer aim which im sure most of you think you have.

It's an OK idea. But some things (like early perma-focus) just mean that the marines get hammered instantly. Even with Armor 1, you have to build up your armory, then arms lab, then get the up. That's like, what, 90 seconds or more? 5 Skulks running around with focus can probably destroy you in that time. I think only certain upgrades should be availble in perma. Like one from each upgrade group. Carapace, Celerity and Scent of Fear. They'd help if you're being spawn camped if you had them the instant you hit the ground, you could move and live through a few more shots.

And Lerks don't make Armor 1 obsolete. As said, welders and meds. Armor 1 means you get a warning bite from that skulk, which just might give you the time you need to turn around and take it out before it finishes you off. Armor 1 counters focus just fine, regardless if the Skulks are noobs or not.

It is possible to shoot skulks without getting hit, or maybe you just prefer the knife. And sure spores is so great except you can hide behind a peice of pebble, to completely resist it. And have you ever played some real games? Because NS has a feature called welder, yeah, it gives eternal armor.

Gee. I wasn't aware I spawned with a machine gun and a pistol, sorry. Although I never said you couldn't just shoot the skulk before it actually did bite you, I was just giving an example or description (whatever. scenario, even?). The welders were suggested before as the counter solution to a focus bite. If you don't have armor one, and they have focus, there's no real point to welders if a skulk gets up close. One chmop, I'm sure you're aware, and you're pretty dead. Getting 3 SCs would take as long as getting Armor 1, I agree (if that's what your suggesting? Shoot me if I'm wrong).

3 SC's, everyone getting permafocus. How do the aliens get any res nodes, or a second hive, or a fade? I don't think early permafocus presents a problem. I don't have an opinion on this idea yet, I just wanted to add that to the discussion.

If they have 3 SCs, get armor and give out a welder or two. You know, they have permafocus in Combat. The Marines can deal with it.

Secondly, I'm all for having this cost 10/20 res to get it, and 5/10 to lose it again. And for keeping it through gestation changes ( Get Cara/Celerity as a Skulk and buy the perma thing, go Fade, buy Regen/Adren, buy perma thing, die, respawn with Cara Celerity, gestate, go Fade with Regen/Adren).

terrible idea. what if when i go fade theres sgers breathing down the hives neck. i get care, defend the hive, run around for a while, eventually die. i spawn with cara again, when regen would be 10x more useful? nothx

a noob will not successfully spawncamp. a noob alien team most likely can counter a spawn camp with the right spawn point. if you want to prevent spawn camping the better idea would be to speed up spawn times depending on what percentage of the team is dead which will not allow the marine to reload to begin spawn camping again.

a good skulk will not rush a marine in "range" even if he does, good skulks will hit max speed bunnyhopping in 1-3 jumps.

I think in principle this is a good addition to the game because it would give people options. You can go classic DMS. You can go focus skulkrush with SC first (no cara/regen though which I think would give Marines tonnes of rfk). The problem with all of this is that you also need to put up res towers and save for Hives/Fades.

I like it because it's an option, an option at that which encourages a system other than DMS. I'm sure you'd get strategies for using the MC first as well. The main thing is that this opens up the game a bit more, something that I'm totally for.

To sum up for people who only read the last post(s), the proposal is that you pay a certain amount of res to get perma(nent) upgrades. This wouldn't mean that you were unable to choose a different upgrade when you respawned, as you have two options:

- Select the slightly faded icon for free 'upgradename'
- Pay 2 res for a different upgrade

The amount to be paid initially would be the sticking point for me, as it would have to be very carefully playtested. I'd imagine immediately that 10 would be too cheap, but it also shouldn't be too expensive to rule out using other chambers to support the upgrade choices made...

A tricky decision, but I'd like to hear any criticisms of the idea.

I still say, don't make it a perma upgrade. Just make it a next X (X is a constant) times you spawn upgrade. Make it slightly cheaper to get the extended version than getting it separately each time. Also, the alien has a long gestation time when initially gestating it (because he doesn't have to gestate again for those next x times). With these changes, I don't think the mass focus rush of doom will be a problem at all. This won't overpower aliens, and if the alien needs to change his upgrade early, then he just wasted some res!

im not sure what ur referencing to about the res gopher, but you say that you won a match against the top european team or whatnot, but if you had read my posts before, i stated that it was one of the FEW ways to keep aliens contained. for example if in tanith, if theyre hive is sat and you have 2 guys in chem and 2 guys in fusion/cargo, technically you are containing the aliens, but some maps do not have this few amount of choke points to be able to contain the aliens and by taking this(spawn camping) away altogether you may not be able to control the aliens and prevent them for breaking through and hitting your nodes.

you say bunnyhopping doesnt make you invincible and its easy to kill and yes that is true, but you were talking about welding while being gassed, good skulks listen, good skulks time their attack, unless they are stupid, they wont suddenly pop out as soon as they hear you gun click (gun draw). welding is extremely loud and what i am saying is that a glide jumper that can hit max speed in 1 jump will most likely own your **** unless its a long hallway.

not neccessarily one room, just keep them contained meaning if they do put up a hive you can easily access that area without getting raped by ambushing skulks. by contained i mean control over the majority of the map
edit: it is unlikely that only one skulk will move out, all it takes is 1 skulk, if he manages to take down that 2 marines gorges may able to put down a oc ONLY to buy time for MORE skulks to come. that delay of 30 seconds for the marines to respawn and run back can make alot of difference

if a skulk needs help he will ask for it. the lerk can be used as bait as a last resort, or 2 skulks can hit 1 marine and the lerk may finish it off.

How about you PM your arguments (which have now gone completely off-topic) instead of pushing the relevant comments further into obscurity.

ON TOPIC:

I do agree that a long gestation for the perma upgrades would be a good idea, as you'd only really be able to spare a player at the beginning of a match to do so so that everyone else can rush and get into position/scout. If it took a decent length of time to gestate for a perma upgrade, I can't see the focus rush happening for more than a few lifecycles as Aliens would want to/need to spend res on higher lifeforms and RTs/chambers.

Maybe a thought could be to have it as a permanant option but depending on which lifeform you buy it, it is slightly more expensive. This increased cost is because if you buy it as an Onos, for example, it will be permanant for all lifeforms 'below' Onos in terms of class cost. Now bear in mind this is just an example (I know some **** is gonna quote me on numbers and say that it would absolutely ruin one sides chances) but here are some rescounts just to give a rough idea of how it could work...

P=Perma Upgrade, all Upgrades are also available at their current cost for 2 Res.

Skulk: P=10
Gorge: P=15
Lerk: P=20
Fade: P=25
Onos:P=30

I'm sure those numbers need serious tweaking, but you also have to bear in mind that if you go Fade and want a permanant upgrade it will still be available when you die and respawn as a skulk, but if you get enough res for an Onos later on the option won't be available (or maybe you have to pay the difference, ie 5 res).

Then again maybe it's best to have a one-off cost for perma upgrades for all classes, making it less confusing and easier to understand. I also am wondering whether Lerk and Gorge should be on the same level of the perma upgrade chain, but then I think that as a Lerk you will be very useful at every stage of the game, whereas gorges kinda tail off with webs... but that's another issue.

Thoughts and comments on whether this extra bit would overcomplicate things/would need tweaking/isn't needed.

Well, this would be rather noob unfriendly.

Just keep it simple: If you want a permaupgrade you can buy one for a static prize. If you want another upgrade you can just override your perma upgrade with an up from the same chamber.


E.G.
Perma ups cost 10 res, normal ones 2.

You are a skulk and evolve perma carapace. Later during the same round you evolve to a Lerk, but cause you want to spore spam the rines you need regen instead of cara. Just evolve normal regen, which overrides perma cara. ( If you die you would still have perma cara so that overriding stays for one lifecycle)

Dont allow player to change their permaup into another one. (This also prevents ppl from spending too much res on changing perma ups)



The whole system could even be simplyfied (spelling???), in order too keep the pop-up menu as small as possible.

When you are holding crouch, while starting gestation you evolve a perma up, instead of a normal up. (This also prevents new players from spending res accidently on perma ups)

The same could also be true for lifeforms: Hold crouch when choosing evolve to gorge, pay 30 res and gain the ability to evolve to gorge for free. (this should only work for gorges and lerks)