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Unknown Worlds Forums > Natural Selection > Natural Selection Discussion > Ideas and Suggestions Forum
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Cheese
Ok this thread is NO suggestion! But since this is the "ideas"&suggestions forum I would like to read peoples ideas for "Natural Selection 2". Please think twice before you post something in here and please dont post single liners. thx

(remember this doenst have to be balanced! These are just ideas and "dreams" ^^)

So i would love to see:

- The War Mode
two different Modes. the classic Natural Selection mode and the War Mode.

The classic mode would contain "normal" maps how we know them while the war Mode would allow up to 100 players to enter a server. The Marine Team would be seperated into about 5 groups with one commander each. the 5 Comamnders would have a personal Commander Chat and would only be able to hear "their" Marines. The maps would be a lot larger. This way Commanders could ask for Support at the Comm Channel-->other Comms ends some of his marines.
The War mode would need Vehicles/bigger lifeforms/mortars/bunkers/dropships. There would also be new Buildings for the Commander to drop (real Armorys with Weapons/Ammunition in it for example) Resource Nodes would still exist but i have no idea how to split the Income.

- Roleplay
A new Friendsnetwork that lets you check self writen Biographies and at which battlefield (server) the Marine/Alien is fighting at this moment. Of course a Biography for an alien isnt really necessary smile-fix.gif
Another importent thing is the Character Customization. Skin/Height/Weight/Muscles/trophies (i guess i wrote that the wrong way)/ customized Armor/customized Skins/Horns for ALiens.

hum okei...that were two ideas. Any others? remember these are just nase-dreams
Lt.Realness
nicely though idea..we've had this before but I don't like it sry..this is too much Starship Troopers like and it doesn't work with the idea of the creators that two nanitenetworks are fighting against each other under specific conditions :/
SlayerPL
QUOTE
Ok this thread is NO suggestion!


didnt you take those ideas from the "200 players" topic? look too much similiar ;p
Cheese
nope the idea is from the Constellation forum! Sry that i forgot that smile-fix.gif I jus thought that the non constis should be able to post their ideas to this topic too
7Bistromath
Well, as long as this is in the "that would be a nice dream" domain...

I'd like to see an SP campaign. It wouldn't need to be very long, just a few missions to develop the story and essentially play the role of a proper training mode. You start as just another marine, gain experience on the ground until you're ready to take the comm, and then the final level is this. You succeed in your mission, but die there, only to find that your consciousness has been absorbed by the Kharaa! (w00t 4 bonus missions)
RedI
Well to be honest i don't think this will work ****

Honestly this is worse than my idea, battlefield meets NS, OH GOD.

CS is better than BF1942, NS OWNS BOTH!!!


The swear filters are there for a reason. Do not evade them again. -Talesin
Ice9
TBH, we should focus on NS and not NS2 right now. Fix version 1, then make another.

asrifle.gif asrifle.gif asrifle.gif
Chaotic_Dragon
Yes i agree there wy not make the ns version more awesome befor you starting planing the new one still long to ns 2 smile-fix.gif






NolSinkler
How about some new aliens?

Oh, and Onos would have to be stronger.

These aliens are in order from lowest to highest. But the fade and the ranged-alien are equal.
Skulk: Base class.
Gorge: Builder
(name): Fills early-game gap between skulk, lerk and fade.
Lerk: Harrasment + support, jetpack counter
(name): An alien focused toward defending aliens and alien structures
Fade: 1 vs. 1 marine killing
(name): Ranged alien
Onos: Mass marine kiling, anti-HA, anti-structure

So, here's my ideas:

Skulk: Same as now, only much faster.

Gorge: Same as now.

Gap-Filler: Fills the gap between skulk, lerk and fade. About the same size as a skulk. 20 resources. 110/25 health. 290 units/second. This alien has a slot-1 melee attack, a slot-2 ranged attack, a slot 3 niche-enhancement, and a slot-4 mass kiling attack. The alien can simply press jump and perform leaps about 1/2 the size of a skulk's leap, for 8% energy.

Lerk: Bumped to 35 resources. Health raised to 105/70. Speed raised to 220 units/second on land, and 3 times that while flying.

Defense: 45 resources. About 2 times the size of a skulk. Works extremely well around healing structures. Health: 175/450. This allows the defensive alien to take massive damage, while near the hive, since if it isn't near the hive the alien will run out of health before armor. 150 units/second. Special Ability: All of this alien's attacks are buffed to 150% power when within healing range of a hive. Attacks: Bite: 120 damage. RoF: .77/second. Sprint: The Defensive alien will gain a 50% speed boost while this is held down. USes 10% energy/second. Silence: All aliens and alien structures within 500 units will be silenced for 5 seconds. Uses 80% energy. RoF: .4/second. Heal: The Defense alien will release a large amount of bacteria to nearby aliens, healing 80 health instantly. Uses 40% energy. RoF: .35/second.

Fade: 60 resources. Same attacks as now. Acid Rocket damage buffed to 50. Health lowered to 250/150. Speed raised to 280 units/second.

Ranged Alien: 60 resources. 170 units/second. Health: 480/225 health. About 40% the size of an Onos. Focuses on range, has a hard time at close range.

Onos: 150 resources. 2550/2100 health (large health added to make up for HL2 being outside.). Speed increased to 250 units/second. Size increased to 125% that of the current onos (making it more feared). Attacks: Gore: 170 damage. Double vs. structures. RoF: 1/second. Uses 8% energy. Devour: The Onos can devour an unlimited amount of marines. However, each marine slows him down by 10%, and each HA marine slows him down by 20%. Digestion time equal to that of now. Stomp: Range doubled forward and wide, and stomp effect added around the onos for 400 units. Uses 30% energy. RoF: .7/second. Charge: Doubles the Onos speed. Lowers the amount of energy of the Onos by 5%/second (2.5% with adrenaline). Any marine in the charging Onos' way will be damaged at 520 damage/second. This is double for structures.
Chaotic_Dragon
Well if you are so in for it wy not take the skins from the aliens in HL2 and use them **** the new aliens siege.gif hive5.gif
theclam
Theoretically the source engine has no player limit, so if NS gets ported there...
I wouldn't worry about it. The devs wouldn't start working on this idea until they start NS2 or port NS onto another engine. It would be neat to have a FPS with huge maps and a large number of players, while still retaining the kharaa play style. However, I don't think the gameplay mechanic would be that great. If it took place outdoors, the aliens wouldn't be able to touch JPs and marines would be able to rule over the long distances even better than before. It if took place indoors, the map sizes would be 3x as big at least. They would have to be so intricate that it would take forever to memorize where all the vents are and where everything is. NS would require a whole new gameplay mechanic, which I think would diminish the specific qualities that make us love NS so much.
BulletHead
Skulk- As Is

Cerebret- larger version of skulk, more powerful "infection" attack rather than parasite, and allows view of HP/AP/Ammo

Lerk1 and Lerk 2 (spikes / Bite)

Gorge- As Is

you catch my drift..

Also, this would NEED to be done on the HL2 engine, as the HL engine can't take that many polys and shaz needed for that big a map... I'd try and make you one, but VHE doesnt' have that much SPACE to make one that big in!
Zunni
I'll sticky this for fun!!!
VB_Phat
If they ported NS they would have to program all the lameness it depends on so heavily.
Pebbles-TPF
It might be nice to discard the whole idea of "class" aliens altogether.

Allow aliens to "evolve" parts of their body to accomplis certain things.

Such as evolving their arms into wings = flying

evolving their mouths in different ways = building, or biting, or spitting, or bile bombing, or spikes, etc.

Different combinations would make a different alien. And you wouldn't be able to evolve with wings, and then evolve into a huge creature to get a flying onos, certain evolution paths would block later paths, etc.

so I could theoretically have a gorge, that built, but had fade swipe attached to it... so you'd have a slow moving fade basically. Good for defense, if they can win, but totally wiped out if a bunch of marines pelted it with bullets.

It's similiar to the concept that was introduced in "NS:Combat" when you purchased your attacks. Only this time, you just purchase evolutions, and thus you get to look different depending on the evolution.

so, little math here, if we did a straight conversion, we'd have 5 aliens, with 4 abilities each, giving us 4^5 different models. If we went with the seperate model for each possible evolution theory. but this is just a limitation.

I really wouldn't mind being a slow flying gorge. I'd love to build an alien "skybase" instead of a marine one biggrin-fix.gif

Pebbs
krimson
stickied? hah. i love it.

anyways, this is a bit much. 100 players and 5 commanders.. that would be whacky.

the lag would be rediculous, the fps would be downright pooped.

if anyone remembers tribes2 and their 128 player servers, its like forget it... the lag was rediculous.. now, agreed, hl2 is much better, the netcode im sure is great, but NS is known for its high computer-eatage already...

we barely have the NS concept down, let alone start mucking around with source, and to then marry them together?

whew!



its a good concept, but a little bit out of reach just yet i think haha.

Maian
In NS2, I'd like to see:

- better graphics of course
- a new strategy layer, like a second resource type, or actual nanobot vs. infestation warfare
- new lifeforms, armor, weapons, packs, tech that fill the niches opened by the new strategy
- mannable turrets, ridable vehicles/mechs (hehe it would be so damn fun)
- larger games and maps, maybe an incorporated campaign system ala Enemy Territory
- more sophisticated commander HUD, i.e. more command groups and all the features that the latest RTS games have
- totally revamped alien evo chamber upgrade system
Stavesacre
I'd think that 100 player servers would be way too much if we had commanders for them all. Maybe if instead of that you could take a page from Warhammer, and have each individual Marine as the core for an AI squad.
IE- if a marine is performing well, pay 10 res to reinforce him with an AI squadmate that mimics the human player, shooting his targets and moving with him.
And give the player the ability to give the AI squad basic commands.
If you did this it would be common to see multiple squads of 10 or more marines led by 3 or 4 Human players.
I dont know if that would fit in the NS universe, but it would be ideal for large scale battles where a large sense of scale would be needed.
And if the commander only had to worry about a few human players as opposed to 30 or so, it would be easier on him and he wouldnt be slamming his head into a spike.

Cheese
hmm it wouldnt fit the natural selection core mode! But i think it would fit into the war Mode!

For Pebbles Idea: OMG i love this one! Different sights would rock too. Kind of remidns me at the Warhammer 40k Tyranids Codex...

asrifle.gif
RedI
QUOTE (Cheese @ Oct 20 2004, 08:10 AM)
hmm it wouldnt fit the natural selection core mode! But i think it would fit into the war Mode!

For Pebbles Idea: OMG i love this one! Different sights would rock too. Kind of remidns me at the Warhammer 40k Tyranids Codex...

asrifle.gif

THIS ISN'T PLANETSIDE
Cheese
mad-fix.gif the second thread, i read, with an absolutely contra productive post from you! Please dont post in here if you dont have anything interesting to say! Thank you very much.





the_x5
Though all this remember that the current setting is not the Milky Way Galaxy. (check your arms people, galaxy arms that is)

I'd also love to see the Kharaa as of being something of dormant ancient lifeform that once controlled that whole galaxy and have now awaken to conquer it again. (mostly because it fits in with this large fan fic I was working on)

~edit~

I'd also love to have the war include vehicles and maybe cross map battles where if you loose on map you go to a different map in sequence. I'd also think wars battles should definitely have that epicness returned where the battles can last for a long time.
CMaster
http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...7933&hl=warfare

ahem ^^

See, I even thought of a good name for it. Anyway, there is some interesting (and in some cases similar) disucssion there. However, it goes to show that people have very different ideas about what such a development could mean. I think making largely urban settings would be cool, and shouldhelp cut down the marine range advantage. Oh, and at least backstory wise (and gameplay as well) we should see a whole variety of new alein evolutions - and lots of hives, still.
IBT
QUOTE (Cheese @ Oct 19 2004, 08:48 AM)
- Roleplay
A new Friendsnetwork that lets you check self writen Biographies and at which battlefield (server) the Marine/Alien is fighting at this moment. Of course a Biography for an alien isnt really necessary smile-fix.gif
Another importent thing is the Character Customization. Skin/Height/Weight/Muscles/trophies (i guess i wrote that the wrong way)/ customized Armor/customized Skins/Horns for ALiens.

i really like that idea.
digz
QUOTE (Pebbles-TPF- @ Oct 19 2004, 11:22 PM)
It might be nice to discard the whole idea of "class" aliens altogether.

Allow aliens to "evolve" parts of their body to accomplis certain things.

Such as evolving their arms into wings = flying

evolving their mouths in different ways = building, or biting, or spitting, or bile bombing, or spikes, etc.

Different combinations would make a different alien. And you wouldn't be able to evolve with wings, and then evolve into a huge creature to get a flying onos, certain evolution paths would block later paths, etc.

so I could theoretically have a gorge, that built, but had fade swipe attached to it... so you'd have a slow moving fade basically. Good for defense, if they can win, but totally wiped out if a bunch of marines pelted it with bullets.

It's similiar to the concept that was introduced in "NS:Combat" when you purchased your attacks. Only this time, you just purchase evolutions, and thus you get to look different depending on the evolution.

so, little math here, if we did a straight conversion, we'd have 5 aliens, with 4 abilities each, giving us 4^5 different models. If we went with the seperate model for each possible evolution theory. but this is just a limitation.

I really wouldn't mind being a slow flying gorge. I'd love to build an alien "skybase" instead of a marine one biggrin-fix.gif

Pebbs

That is one of the most creative ideas Ive read. As a matter of fact, this should be implemented in the current version of NS. HELL, maybe this is the bus.
Mashpit
How about just an idea rather than analyzing everything. i think NS2 needs to take the fight TO the aliens. at the moment most fights are on a marine base. let the marines take the offensive, go to the kharra biggrin-fix.gif
IBT
QUOTE (Mashpit @ Oct 22 2004, 06:55 PM)
How about just an idea rather than analyzing everything. i think NS2 needs to take the fight TO the aliens. at the moment most fights are on a marine base. let the marines take the offensive, go to the kharra biggrin-fix.gif

but you see... we ARE at the kaharra.
the way i see things, the Kaharra just Infest things, they dont have a home, theyre like nomads and hermets they see a pretty ship, they go on it, and try to take it over.

but it would be cool to see where it all started, were the Kaharra FOUND, or CREATED?
Faskalia
Well, since this is all about a dream:

I wished that NS 2 would feature life sized buildings for rines (buildings as big as bunkers/houses) as well as vehicles taht rines could build and drive, of course.

For aliens i want a resize: The onos needs to be as big as a tank.
As well as a squad system, to counter the advanced rine tech (vehicles etc).
E.g. when you spawn as a skulk you spawn with 4 AI buddies, which hunt with you together in a pack. Should you die you could easily take over the role of one of your AIs. Once your pack is dead you need to respawn.

And of course rine vehicles should have a hard time while driving on infested area, thus they needed to clear it before (with the almigthy flamethrower), Gorges on the other hand could just infest the area again.

The maps would be sized for 40 player. This would make a sub-commander usefull, who guides troops into battle so that the actual commander can plan the next offense.

I almost forgot: I want huge outdoor maps.

So plz start working on NS2 now, or you will be introduced to me +1 club biggrin-fix.gif
Cheese
i wrote the lifesized buildings thiong before. i also really like the idea. The only Problem is: atm a Skulk is able to destroy an armory...but hows about a real building?

skulk.gif BIG BUILDING

there would have to be some things like Buildingcritsals they can destroy. And if these Crystalls are destroyed the whole building is destroyed...or something like that
RedI
I just think they should port NS to the Source engine, that would rock, with remade textures models and sounds, that would make NS better than HL2 & CS:S
Silverwing
I would prefer NS to be re-created on Source. A straight port would not take advantage of all the cool new stuff that is possible. It would be a tough one but not as bad as creating a new mod. All the ground-work is done in hl1.

Think of the atmosphere and immersion that would be possible. Keep the game the size it is and work on the finish, imo.
krimson
well, to keep this off-topic little blob going, the nem0 interview mentions what their "sort of" plans are for the Source engine.. basically, from what i got, they are going to see ater a few months of HL2 and stuff as to whether it takes off or not. if HL2 goes over well, then they will sooner or later have no choice than to plan some sort of changeover to the new engine, probably a port at first...

but, they dont want to be hastey, because HL2 could flop like so many other largely hyped games, and it would really be about a 50/50 shot to switch over or not, and instead of wasting say like 6 months or so switching over, and having it just... look nicer, it would be better for them to improve something that is already fairly good.

again. it mostly depends on how well HL2, and HL2 mods go.


personally, i think it will be good. i think doom3 was a hyped up flop, same with farcry. they were, to me, just fillers before hl2 comes out.



back on topic.

i really liked what ... person... man... said about going to different areas if you win or lose...

and then like.. as you get closer to the marine place, the marines can get maybe more supplies or something, but get like... distraught because they are losing, and vice versa.
NolSinkler
We could take the fight to the kharaa, with a cool backstory.

After the aliens had taken control of Nancy, the ship remained dormant, and undisturbed, for an estimated 27 years. At that time, the gravity of a planet which we have named Aerth, for its resemblance of Earth (however with only microbacteria existing so far, it was still a fairly young planet), pulled the ship toward it. The ship landed on Aerth, and exploded - however, the most powerful aliens managed to live, such as the Fade, Onos and Hive. There were 3 hives, of course, on the ship, which couldn't support much more. However, these 3 hives were not enough to support the onslaught of aliens that would become.

The Hive Mind noticed how easily cultivated this planet could be, and sunk all 3 of the hive's roots in the ground. Skulks immediately started to spawn. Many quickly gestated into gorges, dropping resource towers wherever they felt needed - due to the fact that anywhere on the planet could support them.

Within days, the gorges dropped more hives, unlocking the true potential of the Kharaa forces. New species were created by the hivemind, new adaptations, more powerful upgrades, chambers, and such.

They soon created a more powerful hive, which has been named the Primal Chamber. There have been 43 identified on the planet so far. These chambers have increased Kharaa power significantly. Over the 10 years they have been on the planet, an estimated 15 new lifeforms have appeared, some overshadowing even the Fade and Onos. New upgrade trees have appeared. And, furthermore, there are hundreds of millions of Kharaa existing there.

The people of Earth have known about this since the second year of the Kharaa's establishment of Aerth. It seems they have endless resources.

We have, since the fall of Nancy, uncovered many technologies to overtake the Kharaa power. Heavy Armor can now withstand all Acid based attacks, and has been equipped with much more armor.

There is more...


Just an example of taking the battle to the Kharaa.



Think about 20 species of Kharaa though... biggrin-fix.gif
Dakilla
I have "DEREAMD aboute 4 teams like 2 marine vs 2 alien teams.
I also think that 1 comander shuld control ca 5 players.
and then a "general commander"(voted by players) shuld control all other comanders
ore somthing like that...
just one more thing i would love to have acces to punishment for marines in commander mode
asrifle.gif marine.gif
CeReal
I just wan a anti-onos rocket launcher :X
Sub_zer0
to all those whining of its too like start ship troopers inst this game like(a movie) any how so SUYF it is a uterly great idea

picture this your on you battel field hearing over radio 9Hl2 sound fx) ARGHH screams firing your alone then over the horizon a door opens and out comes some thing like a onos but much bigger its chargin for you you call your commander then behind you comes teh back up mortars firginh big daddys of ha (ha could be experament) big tanks of the rines hover ships flying over droping off you fellow squad mates then more aliens come all shapes and sizes out of no where (cloak) anbd BANg the fight begins - c'mon

i love it bring it on (dont forget hl2 luverly ness)
Legat
doublepost....sorry
Legat
Finally implement a flamethrower. I want burning Skulks leaping through the air like flying torches !
Fufaz
So after I've read this I think this Idea with the flamethrower would be very cool and it wouldn't be inpossible.

For me there is no reason for changing any other things on ns I think this game rocks better without 2marine and 2 alien teams. I wouldn't care if there is no change.

But 1 thing could be changed. To making the game running without steam. wink-fix.gif

greets
CaCa
QUOTE (Silverwing @ Oct 23 2004, 08:10 PM)
I would prefer NS to be re-created on Source. A straight port would not take advantage of all the cool new stuff that is possible. It would be a tough one but not as bad as creating a new mod. All the ground-work is done in hl1.

Think of the atmosphere and immersion that would be possible. Keep the game the size it is and work on the finish, imo.

true, of course... no doubt about it...

yet I must say that for what the spirit of NS seems to be, the DOOM3 engine fits like a glove... yeah, yeah, I know how all yer reactions're gonna be to this comment, but dammit I believe the D3 engine was practically made for NS to evolve!

so, besides that modern point, ever since it's beginnings *my* personal dreams for NS have been:

o A redesign of the Kharaa models... I don't see 'em as bacterial alien lifeforms so much as they seem like farm animal lifeforms: a cow, a dog, an eagle, a pig, and a man-cat... how 'bout some creativity here? I've offered my own "bacterial lifeform" concepts in the past... I guess traditionalists will always have their way, regretably...

o A good shadow system to thwart gamma cheaters (DOOM3, anyone?)


...and I could die a happy gamer...
monopolowa
I'd like to toss the idea in this thread out there as a possible idea for NS2...I dont really think it can work with the HL engine/through steam, but it's definitely got potential for the next game
Sheepe
A closely packed city with the subways infested could serve for very large maps...
Skulks jumping off skyscrapers to get JetPackers... hmmm...

-Sheepe
Takran
QUOTE (CaCa @ Nov 16 2004, 08:34 PM)
QUOTE (Silverwing @ Oct 23 2004, 08:10 PM)
I would prefer NS to be re-created on Source. A straight port would not take advantage of all the cool new stuff that is possible. It would be a tough one but not as bad as creating a new mod. All the ground-work is done in hl1.

Think of the atmosphere and immersion that would be possible. Keep the game the size it is and work on the finish, imo.

true, of course... no doubt about it...

yet I must say that for what the spirit of NS seems to be, the DOOM3 engine fits like a glove... yeah, yeah, I know how all yer reactions're gonna be to this comment, but dammit I believe the D3 engine was practically made for NS to evolve!

so, besides that modern point, ever since it's beginnings *my* personal dreams for NS have been:

o A redesign of the Kharaa models... I don't see 'em as bacterial alien lifeforms so much as they seem like farm animal lifeforms: a cow, a dog, an eagle, a pig, and a man-cat... how 'bout some creativity here? I've offered my own "bacterial lifeform" concepts in the past... I guess traditionalists will always have their way, regretably...

o A good shadow system to thwart gamma cheaters (DOOM3, anyone?)


...and I could die a happy gamer...

I see no reason why anyone would have any problems with the engine that Doom 3 uses; it was the game, not the engine, that was overrated.

The doom shadowing in NS would be... gasp.. sort of like what NS used to have! What a novel concept, let's make a dark, heavily atmospheric game have shadows! Seriously, the walls in NS shine brighter than my mag-lite. It's disheartening.

What happened to the intended 'feel' of the game? This has been brought up plenty of times, but let me tenderize the horse a bit. Where's the 'OMG PWNOS' screams over voice comm? What happened to skulks actually hiding in shadows, without cloaking? Maps are brighter and less claustrophobic than they used to be.

Meh. I must go to bed. But if there is one dream I have, it is for NS to return to its original concept.
Ano
QUOTE (CaCa @ Nov 16 2004, 08:34 PM)
QUOTE (Silverwing @ Oct 23 2004, 08:10 PM)
I would prefer NS to be re-created on Source. A straight port would not take advantage of all the cool new stuff that is possible. It would be a tough one but not as bad as creating a new mod. All the ground-work is done in hl1.

Think of the atmosphere and immersion that would be possible. Keep the game the size it is and work on the finish, imo.

true, of course... no doubt about it...

yet I must say that for what the spirit of NS seems to be, the DOOM3 engine fits like a glove... yeah, yeah, I know how all yer reactions're gonna be to this comment, but dammit I believe the D3 engine was practically made for NS to evolve!

so, besides that modern point, ever since it's beginnings *my* personal dreams for NS have been:

o A redesign of the Kharaa models... I don't see 'em as bacterial alien lifeforms so much as they seem like farm animal lifeforms: a cow, a dog, an eagle, a pig, and a man-cat... how 'bout some creativity here? I've offered my own "bacterial lifeform" concepts in the past... I guess traditionalists will always have their way, regretably...

o A good shadow system to thwart gamma cheaters (DOOM3, anyone?)


...and I could die a happy gamer...

Thats exactly what i think.
The Doom3 Engine is absolutly perfect fo ns.

One other thing is, that nearly half of the Doom3 sourcecode is open. (in the SDK)
And it is explained very good.

I'm for a port!


--Ano

urinalcake
no one ever discusses the vehicles :/

we could be looking at a possible Tribes 2-like gameplay, bu it's actually fun!
*GASP*
NukeAJS
I propose that for NS2 this system be used. As a basis, each "organism" starts with only one "form" upgrade. More hives = more "form" transformations. This is in addition to the upgrades we already have. All aliens start with their first three skills, their fourth skill must be purchased as a hive3 upgrade (optional). I'm not putting resource amounts simply because I have no idea how this would need to be balanced.

For instance, if there is one hive and a DC is dropped a Skulk can gestate to a fade and get the carapace upgrade. Once a new hive is spawned and a MC dropped, that fade can transform his body to augment his abilities (we'll just say he takes extra bulk, which increases his hp, armor, and damage but makes him a much bigger target). Also, since a MC was dropped he can pick up an upgrade too! This could make him an Extra bulk, carapace, celerity, fade. If the final hive was secured he would get to choose his 4th skill and final upgrade. This means he could be an extra bulk, carapace, celerity, phasing fade.

This is basically a secondary upgrade system that instead of changing how you engage the enemy (like the current upgrade system) completely changes the style of play. A grid-communication (ability to maniulate strucutures [NOT BUILD] via a pop-up menu) gorge would play much much much more different than a birth canal gorge (gorge that can spawn players at his or her location instead of a hive). Upgrades would not longer be based on perferance but rather what is needed. A gorge with grid communication would find regenration useless since he can use a distant DCs power to regenerate himself whereas a birthcanal gorge would need regeneration badly (due to being near the front lines of battle a lot). It's really long but I think a lot of the ideas are quite interesting. I give kudos to the guy who thought up the transformation idea. It was such a cool idea that I had to modify it a bit.

Hive 1 ------------

Base organism -> Skulk, has wall walk, maybe different skills. Free.

Available upgrades/augmentations immediately ...

Biped/size increase (Fade transformation) - Grants Fade form. Swipe, blink, and metabolize seem ok right now for balance reasons.

Wings(takes place of skulk claws)/size increase (Lerk transformation) - Grants lerk form, it's your good ole' lerky! A flight adjustment might be order (I want to be able to strafe and spore).

Hive ability/size increase (Gorge transformation) - Grants gorge form. Makes you a "mini-hive" with the ability to spawn inanimate organisms (alien structures). He'll be more armored and tougher since he is a mobile hive. His self-defense skills will remain the same.

Now each available hive allows more additions or changes to an alienlifeform. I'll give some ideas ...

Hive 2 -----------------

at this point in the game up to two chambers will be dropped. Unlike Hive1 transformations, further transformations to your lifeform require the appropriate chamber to get genetic information to do so. So you will really only have one choice out of two. You may only choose one hive2 transformation per lifeform and it sticks with you whenever you gestate into that lifeofrm.

Skulk transformation options -
Enhanced vision - Requires a SC, augments the skulks eyes to have x-ray vision (sight penetration of a wall depending on its thickness), infravision (detects heat, possibly where marines have stepped, also makes marines have an aura so they can be easily detected before turning a corner in case a wall is too thick), and enhanced hive vision (able to tell the health status of friendly players and structures)
Walking dead - Requires a DC, instead of being respawned at the hive, the skulk is respawned at his place of death seven seconds after he originally dies. Works only once before having to be re-learned.
Silence - (moved from MC upgrade to transformation) - Adds padding to all exterior parts of the body and removes voicebox.

Fade transformation options -
Camoflague - Requires a SC, enables fade to constantly have a "water" effect on him that is pretty easy to see while he is still but makes him much more difficult to focus and aim at while moving.
Enhanced bulk - Requires a DC, makes fade larger granting him more HP, armor, and damage per swipe. Also makes him easier to hit.
Silence (moved from MC upgrade, to a lifeform transformation) - adds addition padding to all parts of the body, removes the voicebox.

Lerk transformation options -
Attenae - Requires a SC, increases the range of hearing by five times, also creates scent of fear icons on all marines within a short range (maybe enough to barely get one decent sized room with a lerk in the center)
Size decrease - Requires a DC, makes the lerk retain the same defense and offensive skills but shrinks his size to half making him much more harder to hit.
Stamina - Requires a MC, Eliminates energy expenditure for flying only.

Gorge transformation options -
Grid communication - Requires a SC, allows gorge an organ/attenae, or kind of way to use his abilities on structures without being near them. This is not commander mode for aliens! Instead, it enables a button that a gorge can use and bring up a pop-up menu and general location for all the structures he has built. If a structure is damaged he can use energy and heal the structure without actually being there. Does not work for hive structures. Enables gorge to recycle his structures if desired from accross the map. Also, the communication works both ways. A gorge can force a chamber to put its powers in him. This option would make the original chamber from which the ability is being borrowed become disabled. For instance, if a Gorge "steals" the defense chamber ability he begins to regenerate all friendlies around him. A movement chmaber heals stamina. I think a SC cloaking all players aroudn the gorge is way too powerful, instead i suggest that all marines within range of the gorge get SoF icons.
Environmentally friendly - Requires a DC, changes the entire dna structure of the gorge so that when it dies, 90% of the resources spent on lifeforms and transformations are refunded once respawned as a skulk. Marines get res like usual.
Birth canal - Requires a MC, constructs the same organ in the gorge that the hive has in order to respawn friendly skulks near it (at spawned players option). This transformation permits dead skulks the option of spawning near the gorge with this upgrade instead of a hive. Only skulks can respawn and only players who want to do, (so you aren't forced to spawn where you don't want). Spawn rate is twice as slow as a hive. If a skulk uses a MC he can opt to "kill" himself and be reconstructed near the gorge. Only one per team.

Hive two only transformations ------

Reprisal transformation (Onos form) - Grants Onos form, enables gore, devour, stomp, and a 4th skill (does not have to be purchased and something better/different than charge).

Hive three transformations ----- All lifeforms but onoss get to choose their final skill. Onos gets upgrades similiar to how the other lifeforms get their upgrades at Hive2.

Skulk abilities -
Xenocide - Requires three hives, BOOM!
Infectious bite - Requires three hives, bite infects marine to drop to one hp. Countered only by commander-dropped meds.
Enhanced leap - Requires three hives, enables leap twice the distance, twice the speed, five times the damage, very little energy.

Fade abilities -
Acid Rocket - Requires three hives, Annilates armor, weak against health.
Double Dragon - Requires three hives, another fade to "connect" to. Ultimate fade skill with huge disadvantages. This makes a biological link to another fade with this skill. While in range of each other all abilities/upgrades are GREATLY enhanced, however, one master fade (determined at linkage, players do not know who is the master fade until damage has been dealt) takes the damage dealt to both players. There is a 50% percent than when the master fade dies, the other fade must get within healing range of the hive within seven seconds or it will be slain as well.
Phase - Requires three hives, Instead of quickly traveling from point A to B. The fade clicks, and in a half a second appears where he clicks. Can be used in conjunction with blink for ultimate escapes, uses a lot of energy (half?)

Lerk Abilities -
Scream - Requires three hives, same as now, maybe lasts a tad longer.
Sanctuary - Requires three hives, Within a second the lerk creates a cacoon that can withstand nearly 6k damage and hides inside. The lerk can only use hivesight to see outside the egg. Used as last resort until team can save him, as a protection against surprise attacks.
Knockout gas - Requires three hives, Instead of damaging players, knockout gas cripples the senses of the other team by blurring vision, causes hallucinations both visual and auditory, and slows all marines for five seconds after the cloud is escaped.

Gorge Abilites -
Web - Requires three hives, JPers never stood a chance. NOT blown up by grenades (welders still work).
Babblers - Requires three hives, Old skool. Make em smarter and not attacking friendlies.
Goo trap - Requires three hives, large piece of goo is flung at the same trajectory as a bile bomb, however, if it hits a marine player they are entrapped in the goo and can not move or even be beaconed for ten seconds. they take no damage.

Onos transformations -
Threat warning -Requires three hives and a SC, Gives Onos upgraded SOF. Upgraded because it permits the Onos to see what weapon and what type of marine is there instead of just a marine.
Fat of the land - Requires three hives and a DC, layers of mammalian-liek fat are added over muscle. Increases damage absorption (armor only) by x1.5.
Burnout - Requires three hives and a MC, muscular augments permit attacks to be twice as fast, uses x1.5 times the stamina.

Notes on silence -----

I love silence but it just doesn't compare to celerity or adrenline 95% of the time. (movement rush being the only time I get silence in NS). Instead I've added silence as a transformation to skulks and fades. In silence's place will be something else dealing with movement. The only thing I could think of was "Joints".

Joints (MC upgrade, not a transformation) - Requires a MC, Joints adds addition joint to a Kharaa that enable much more complex and distracting movements. With joints, it is possible to press one direction (besides foreward) and then leap directly thereafter. Instead of leaping foreward, the skulk leaps to the side while still facing forewards. This works for the leap, blink, flight, and stomp skills. For a gorge it enables quake-style bunny hopping.

I have lots of marine ideas as well to counter these seemingly beefy Kharaa skills.
Yash
QUOTE (NukeAJS @ Jan 9 2005, 05:57 AM)
I have lots of marine ideas as well to counter these seemingly beefy Kharaa skills.

Can you post those too?
Otherwise, you look like your pro-alien >_>
ReK
Alright, my idea is large outdoor maps, but not necessarily spacious, ie urban areas, mountain range, a large field with a complex system of caves directly below.
Now, to the marines. Keep basic marine armour/weapons the same (add some new of each), the major addition would be squads and vehicles. 1 General, an overall commander who plans the full field of the battle, assign base building waypoints and what kind of base he wants (read: not individual buildings). He does, however, have complete control of the home base/drop point and its defenses. 2 or 3 sub commanders, map-dependant. These handle the orders given by the general, as well as squad commands and individual construction.
Squads: Consist of 5 marines, plus a sergeant. The squad works as a team. The sergeant is the only one with communication with the rest of the command net, the other marines can only hear/see what their squadmates say/type. If the sergeant dies, a warning is sent out to the commander in charge of them, he then assigns the remainder of the squad to assist/reinforce another one over an emergency channel.

Vehicles: 3 classes, heavy assualt, light assualt/transportation, and air.

Heavy:
Tank, 1 main gun, two front-corner mounted machine guns (operators exposed), 3 or 4 marines can ride on the side a la halo.
Howitzer tank, 1 main gun (launches high cal mortars), 1 mg front mounted, 2 possible riders
APC, 1 mg with operator inside, 1 rear mg with operator slightly exposed, can carry one squad excluding driver (mg opers included)
Drill tank (underground only) can drill new tunnels, has a main gun mounted in front and a rear mg (this requires destructable terrain, like red faction)

Light:
Assualt Jeep: warthog ripoff, rear mounted mg, one side rider, one driver, 1 marine can also ride in back with mg.
Transport truck: 1 driver, 1 passenger, 6 marines in back (can look over sides to shoot)
Bike: 1 person vehicle, no weapons, extremly fast, used by commanders/scouts
Attack ATV: 1 person motorcycle, front mounted dual machine guns, slightly slower than the bike.

Air:
Dropship: holds 6 marines, two of which operate mg turrets placed on either side of the fuselage. 1 pilot, with forward facing, low powered heat seekers, mostly just for harrasment. (very effictive against alien heat signatures) Not very maneouverable. Marines disembark by landing or jumping, after parachutes are researched. They cannot fire while jumping.
Helicopter: higher powered heat seekres, forward facing mg, 2 marines in back, manning a side firing mg, a la vietnam choppers. (2nd marine is busy with ammo belts)
Jet fighter/bomber: forward firing mg/missles, bomb bays capable of holding 10 dead reckoning bombs, can be upgraded to gps targeted (targets set by general)

Now, this may seem to be way overpowering the rines, but heres the alien stuff.

4 types of body frames, small, medium, large and giant. small being skullk sized, medium fade, large current onos, giant, alien version of a biological tank, literally the size of a bus. These types give inherent hp/ap values, as well as speed modifiers.

Major evolutions:
Wings (only on small to large sizes)
Gas flight (zepplin style, on large-giant only).
3 levels of armour, light, medium and heavy. Heavy cannot be used with any kind of flight. All give speed restrictions.
Legs: bipedal (required for wings, less weight availiable (each upgrades adds/subtracts from total weight)), quardruped (higher speed, more weight avaliable), centipedal, required for giant lifeforms, can support most weight, is slowest.
Arms: none (required for wings), One (required for builders, can lift the most weight), two and four.
Digits: claws, builder extension, manipulators (must have two arms, allows the alien to operate basic marine epuipment, such as less-complicated weapons and welders), blades (fade style)
Other weapons: here goes bile bomb, acid rocket, etc. Note that all lifeforms have the basic bite attack, although size and number of arms, strength, etc affect damage.

Note that for giant lifeforms, they have the option of a hollow body, which will allow them to carry other aliens at the cost of health. for flyers with hollow bodies, they can carry a supply of acid packets, provided by a builder, to drop as bombs.

Attributes:
Armour: Decided by weight and body type and related upgrades
Health: Decided by body type and related upgrades
Strength: Decided by body type, number of arms/legs and related upgrades.
Basic attacks: dedided by number of arms, legs, etc (four arms will have a swipe/claw/punch attack instead of bite.
Intelligence: the more of this an alien has, the higher level marine equipment it can use. Determined by body type, digits, arms, legs, and weight. Those values closest to human will give higher intelligence. Also, evolving certain upgrades, such as cranium capacity, symbiote will increase it, while adrenaline, strenght and such will decrease it. Note that an alien MUST have manipulator digits to operate marine stuff. If extremly close to marines physically (ie bipedal, two arms, medium body size, similar weight, stregth, etc), can wear the marine body armour. This brings up covert infiltration, especially while in heavy armour.



Gameplay modes: two major modes, both having submodes that are the actual different types of games, like co, ns, war, etc.

Campaign: Character is built upon and saved, similar to a battle.net system. Alien evolutions, marine armour and tech, weapons, personal vehicles, etc are all saved. The character is given a power rating based on it upgrades, similar to wh40k. Team fairness is determined by these values. You can upgrade you character in game to whatever you want, it will not be saved, but through the menus you can use stat points to buy base upgrades that you will always spawn with. This is undoable. You gain stat points by playing well, winning games etc. Before you cry imbalance, refer back to the advancement points idea. Now, this invites hacking the char files, so have all files on a file server. all files are read-only, and the server modifies them based on stats reported by whatever server the client is playing on.

Skirmish: classic style, everyone starts equal and builds up in game.


Now that ive spent my hour typing this, im sure many will have many problems with this, but keep in mind this is very rough, everything is suspect to change, and it all assumes that ns2 will have a very capable engine as well as at least 64 players erver caps.

I have purposly left out buildings because im out of ideas for now, and tired of typing tounge.gif


On a side note, i wouldnt mind seeing the current version of ns ported to the ut2k4 engine and have a few stuff added, not that itll ever happen. That engine is certainly capable of large maps and all sorts of vehicles.
Cleric_Epoch
I think it should use the battlefield 2 engines. As that allows for players to spawn in vehicals still ebing piloted by their squad mates. So In large battles you dont always get seperated.
It could include vehicals, ^^like above^^ and large maps, that scale to the amount of people in them, aswell as a decent psycics engine with desctrutable terrain.
NsFaNtIc
here a idea that is cool u can like make a special alien that lets u infest the marines buildings cept the com center.when the buildings r infested it becomes a defence building....or not,or it can self-desruct on marines..confused-fix.gif

combine the skulk with the gorge to make this creature???.....

skulk.gif pudgy.gif
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