Disclaimer: I am not bitching. If this come across as bitching, sorry. I'd genuinely like to know how to do this .

I've played a few hours of NS so far (about ten in two days ) mostly as Kharaa. I realised pretty much from the start that they're not just reskinned marines, and that the fighting style is different. Fine, not a problem. I can see that in the early stages when the marines have only light armour it's relatively easy to kill them with skulks. I've also found that it's not impossible to take out heavy armour\gren launcher\hmg marines using a carapice, cloaking fade.

The problem is, how do you take out heavy armour, hmg marines using a skulk? Its seems to be an inherent flaw in the RTS genre that once one side starts falling behind in the resources and the other side gains a monopoly the losing side is royally screwed.

I know you don't go head-to-head. I realise you're meant to hit-and-run them, but how exactly do you hold off four marines wearing heavy armour carryinh heavy machineguns attacking your hive (with no offense chambers) with only a skulk?

It is very hard to fight against a heavy armor marine with HMG or GL.

I dunno exactly, but I think the only good tip I can give you is using defense chambers. Try to hit and run back to the chambers, so you can heal quickly, but I have to admit that its really hard to fight as a skulk against such powerful equipped marines.

well thats the thing about the ka...  you dont let them take resource things, or you dont let them the leway to get enough to upgrade to that... though i found xenocide capable to heavily damage/kill a nice group of marines in heavy or do it with some others against a fortification... (IE their turrets)

A GL marine can easily be trapped into blowing himself up if attacked by a skulk or lerk.  As a skulk, just get in his face.  If he hits you directly, the grenade explodes in his face killing him.  If he misses, the grenade is sitting on the ground for four seconds, and he usually won't be able to keep track of all his grenades.  As a lerk, he won't be able to grenade you as you're flying over his head dropping spikes.  Just watch out in case he whips out a pistol.

For HMG marines, you're best off with a cloak-carapaced fade assault from behind with that nasty set of cutters.

Either way, if the guy's in heavy armor, you're best off attacking with a buddy; maybe a skulk to run around and confuse him, or a gorge to lead him into an ambush, or another fade to double the cutting speed.

If you see more than one marine in heavy armor, wet your flesh and kiss your hive goodbye, because you've let them keep too many resources.

One thing to note, the devs have confirmed a bug that allows marines to progress through the tech tree much more quickly.  This isn't the same as server admins adjusting the settings, so once this is fixed, expect marine tech to show up much more slowly.

You can also expect less turret farms since the turrets cost so damn much.  Heavy Armor is also pretty expensive, so you'll start seeing more balanced fireteams.

Anyway, here's how to use the skulk.  Do you see those little vents and crawlspaces scattered around the map.  Those lead EVERYWHERE.  If you see marines ahead, you can usually jump into a nearby vent and pop out of a vent not too far behind them.  It also helps if you've parasited those marines so you know exactly when and where to pop out.

Once you get behind them, if they're going to attack a base, wait until they start the attack and engage the offensive chambers, then rush in behind and chomp away while they're distracted.  If they're just moving along for another purpose, use hit and run where you pick the weakest troop in there kill him then run into another vent and pop out somewhere else to attack the next weakest.  When you're down to that heavy armor, I'd really suggest that you do 2-3 bites, then run, more if they're not paying attention to you at all.

I don't think there really is a way to beat a heavy armor, hmg carrying marine with a skulk. It's 2 or 3 bullets and you're dead. Because hmg fires in full-auto, you'll die if he gets you under his crosshair. If skulks could somehow kill marines in a sinlge bite by biting in their heads or necks would be cool. Right now skulks are nothing more than annoying little bugs who can barely scratch heavy armor.

About using Xenocide, yes that sounds like a great idea except for the fact that you need three hives! If you've only got one hive left, your back is against the wall and the only thing you can afford is the Skulk you start with, with no upgrades, what tactics can you use against heavily equipped enemies?

As a skulk, you need to do three things to kill heavy armored troopers.

1.  Get level 3 carapace (celerity is also suggested)
2.  Wait in ambush on the ceiling
3.  Jump down and run circles around them biting randomly.

You should never expect to take out a group of heavy marines alone.  Bring a friend to magnify the carnage.

Don't depend on it, but it can be done. I was on ns_caged recently and walked up to 3 HA/HMG marines who were busy building a resourcer. Leapt around for a bit, chewed all their armor off and then left once the shock wore off. Went back to my hive, healed and came back 30 seconds later. Unfortunately, 2 of them had left so I only got 1 kill out of it.

As for coming from behind, your team couldn't hold on to even footing, how logical is it to expect them to fight from a disadvantage?

Y'know... The only ONLY time I've EVER seen the Kharaa win is if everyone just bum rushes the Marine spawn at the very beginning. And keeps doing it. Till they win...

The Kharaa are no fun to play. =( They always seem to be fighting a losing battle...

actually when me and my friends play small games like 4on4, the teams are pretty much balanced if both teams know what to do in the very beginning. and know how to react to different stuff.


first i thought that the game was badly unbalanced but by playing more and more (about 8 hours a day ) i have managed to create some tactics that help with the kharaa.

in the end when both teams know how to play as a team the sides are pretty balanced. of course the marines still have a little advance but thats nothing

Well question is WHY should SULK win HA and HMG marine while normal marine with normal MG have no change againt onos even with group where is 3 marines? :/

edit: agree all that mio says...as alien you just need skill and will or something

Balance is done on COST.

Cost of a Skulk: 0

Upgrades: 0 to 6

Total: 0 to 6 rps per skulk.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Cost of a Marine: 0

Cost of Heavy Armor: 20 rps

Cost of Heavy Weapon: 20 to 30 rps

TOTAL: 40 to 50 resources.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Basically, a Marine toting all that equipment has to kill AT LEAST 6 to 8 skulks before he has paid for himself.

This game is an RTS.

Would you expect a zergling to kill a siege tank in Starcraft? didn't think so.. . . .

Humbaba is quite right. A fully upgraded Fade is much more of a match for the HA+HMG combo marine, especially in the right situation. And an Onos pays for itself easily.

well is the siege tank deployed? because that matters because... well nm...
My tactic is to hid above where marines would walk (and be sure its at least 2 skulks above the doorway) and they run by, wait 2~3 seconds (for backup lagging behind) and hit them and run...

oh yeah, this isnt doom. Strafe+hop

I'm tired of all these unbalance issues. The game is VERY BALANCED. The only inbalance that i can tell is not on the alien side. (btw i'm an alien player) its on the marine. With a low number of ppl on the team, like 4vs4 i find the aliens have the advatage, because the marines don't have enough ppl to kill off 3 aliens running around causing havok. Also the aliens can easily run off and get 3 resource points without the marines even noticing. In a large game (like 12vs12 and up) the human commander has to be damn good. I've yet to see a commander be able to deal with his whole team. (in a team of 12vs12 or higher) I don't think a 2nd commader would be the answer to the higher player game though.

ok lets pick another rts....warcraft 3.
how do ne or ud or orcs or humans win a game you are losing bad? Its hard. Just like in this game. You can win, but good luck. How do the marines win when they are losing bad? I've played a game where the marines were fighting ownos's with only shotguns. They lost 5 seconds later.