I find that the best way to learn mapping skills and techniques is lots of practice, and of course seeing how others do it. However, you can only learn so much from tutorial maps, and they're almost non existant in the NS mapping scene.

In this thread you post the source to your map, in the format of your choice (.rmf preffered, most people use VHE). Include the lights.rad if you're using texture lights, and any other info you'd like to post. Hopefully we can get a nice amount of sources, and hopefully something from the pros. Feel free to post old unreleased stuff, incomplete maps, and WIP maps.

The purpose of this thread is to collectively build mapping resources so that people can learn. I'll assume I'm not the only one that's seen something in a map and wondered "how'd they do that?!". By posting map sources, a lot of techniques can be learned by others who are viewing brush placement, texture allignment, and entity useage.

Please, do not blatantly rip off other peoples work. If you do outright copy and paste other peoples work, expect that the mapping community will probably never take your work seriously again.

I guess that's all. Let's see your work!

Here are some of mine:
NS_Train - my current mapping project. the marines get word of kharaa infestation in the lab terminal of the underground research facility. All exits have been blocked off by infestation, the only way in is the subway...
http://www.sapinski.com/ns/ns_train.zip

co_map1 - an older CO map I was working on. I started adding some random crap because DXO wanted a flaytona map, but I didn't finish it.
http://www.sapinski.com/ns/co_kowmap1.zip

co_funmap1 - a fun map concept I was toying with. the MS is covered with little lifts that shoot you up to the hive for a few seconds. not finished.
http://www.sapinski.com/ns/co_kowfunmap1.zip

Two problems here:

A) Most mappers are very jealous of their content. The majority of us want to keep our work our work, and would not like to see something we made ripped wholesale from a donation.

B) Having map sources openly available would encourage people just ripping off content and not actually learning. Especially things like vertex mapped infestation and particle systems seem prone to this to me. Basically anything that is tedious to do to begin with. Problem is that those are the more difficult things to learn how to make when mapping. Essentially i'm saying that if we post this a majority of people will download it, harvest whatever they don't know how / are too lazy to build, and go on with the rest of their map.

I'm not trying to discourage the creation of additional mapping resources. I just want you to keep in mind that you may get very little in the way of assistance, and that those things which are contributed may just be stolen without really helping anyone besides people who don't want to learn how to make things for themselves.

As to your tutorial comments: There are plenty of half life mapping tutorials. Too many for them to be a scarcity. There are also a significant number of NS specific tutorials. In addition there are irc channels such as #mapcore and #nsmapping where you can find people that will help you. Not to mention the fact that there is a mapping help and troublshooting subforum specifically made for people to ask for assistance. I guess i'm just saying that, in my opinion, the need you are attempting to fill has already been filled.

if you want to know how things work in a map, learn mapping. NO ONE is going to give out their source files. these things are like children to us, they mean a lot to us someone can just change this and that and say its their map.

Yeah. Not to name names, but a certain English-impaired member of the mapping forums, who is currently on vacation, managed to rip off maps without the source (ala Decompile). Imagine what would happen if people like that HAD the source

theres no way i wud give my source out, its probably around 700 hours work by now

now if u said, we shud make a little room with interesting brushwork that might be more plausable, but entire maps?

kay , 4 maps which i dont know what they are , but hey , theyre OLD !!!!

You HAVE to be kidding me

well im not going to give out my good maps noone will, but maby a map that you gave up on, or something. Some people might release them. Or even a room showing off a difficult aspect of mapping. And as for those who will just cut and paste, well their lame i have never cut and pasted out of a map i just study it then reproduce it to my liking and i suspect the majority of people who are serious about learning mapping will do the same.

Guess it can't hurt, help those who are learning out.

Map sources are as someone said earlier, like children to us mappers. That is correct. But if anyone have something that they're sure they NEVER will ever try to finish, they might as well try to help som newbies to learn about brush placements, and entity techniques. I will post something as soon as I can find anything that I won't even maybe use in a map ever.

And this is actually not a very stupid idea, but not a smart one either..
So if anyone choose to post sources, post something that you don't want to see again. Then you won't be so much **** off if anyone actually says that's it's their own work.

Nova looks like that in game i believe... a big smiley face, or sad face. Whatever.

this I like... this helps ppl see HOW some of those sexy things in maps are made (wish I could see toxic and teabag and rusts .rmf... I still can't figure out how HALF that stuff was done!)

mm... gg I'm a stupid newbie! XD

But seriously... anyone with ANY honor won't take a halfway done map and try to finish it as their own... for if they have half a brain they'd notice the change from elite to nub in no time!

Ffs can you just **** off please.

1)People pour all their energy into their maps and spend a long time getting it just right.
2)**** off, why should people say ohhh ok heres the source when some low life will rip off the map.

Showing your rmfs to your friends when you need help or they want your help thats fine cos you trust them.But posting your source on a public forum thats just idiotic.

If you want to help new people to mapping then use like zipped editor shots or just use the huge amount of example rmf and map files.

Should anybody ask how I did something in a specific map I'd usually just copy the part of the map into a new .rmf and send it to the guys. That's under the point of "helping fellow mappers". Currently however there are only 4 guys that I'd send whole map sources to, simply because I know i can trust them (and two live close to me so I can beat the **** out of them if neccessary ^_^).

Posting whole sources for the general public will not really help newbies to learn mapping that much, it will most likely promote ripping other peoples stuff off. Just look at our local Mr. "I didn't decompile that map and put that corridor 1:1 into my map. made it all by miyself. really!"...

Helping on specific parts of a map, no problem - making a whole project (wich we know can takes months or ever over a year!) available for download to everyone, no thx sir. Just my 2 cents anyway...

/Hyper

the possibility of your map getting ripped off are very small. think of it this way: if someone doesnt have enough talent to make their own map, and rips rooms from yours, they're going to release a crappy map with some good rooms, joined together with crappy rooms and crappy hallways. you shouldnt have too much trouble convincing people that they ripped off your map, as your style will continue throughout the map build that you're working on. I seriously urge more people to reconsider and possibly release their source. there isnt too much bad to come out of this, plagiarism isn't really anything to worry about.

it is something to wry about.. very much so.. Ive seen mods rip stuff of of other mods, claim it as their own, and no one knew who actually did the work. You may no steal stuff, but there are plenty of ppl that would.

There's no way in hell I would be giving out my map sources if it wasn't really needed, in fact, I hate looking at other people's sources if it's not needed, either... I delete the sources of other people's maps when I finished helping them or sent back the file to them.

If you need to learn... well...

1.- Read tutorials
2.- Practice
3.- Ask

I haven't asked any mapping specific questions while I was learning, I guess using search engines and some common sense helps, if I could do that... why can't other people do the same thing?

Hehe. As much as I'd want to I gotta resist the eagerness to download any of your works. I'm one of those against this whole idea. At first I thought: "well, why not?", but suddenly changed my mind. There is really very much different ways to map. I want to find my own. Maybe this makes sense to some people and to some it doesn't, but that way I feel.

This is the problem. Every time I map I seek to make something different, something I can definetly say is my own. Still, wether you think it or not, you got these influences from other maps. I shouldn't say this is a problem cause that usually isn't, but it's somehow keeping me from being creative.

I think that some people can really benefit from open sources. That is if one wants to learn mapping (not copy/paste and so on). Myself, I don't find them useful because I always get so confused from what I see. I see whole lots of entities, but don't know how they work or how they are targetted to each other. I see some very complex, yet amazing looking brushes, but don't know how they were made. "How did he do it, what technicue did that guy use?"

edit: Now that I've though this out... making example maps, which are meant to show newbies how things are done should be encouraged. I now agree with others, that it's not good to take influences from other mappers' rmf files. I think I've now made my opinion clear.

It would take a lot of convincing, even at the amateur stage I am at, to get me to publicly post my source. If I had put as much into mapping as these other guys have over the long years, I never would. It seems to me that it's a "mapper's ettiquite" that a mapper's source is very private and not to be compromised... Let'sbe honest while it IS addictive mapping is still a difficult and often frustrating endeavor, a good map is a triumph, and no one wants to see someone cheapen all the work that goes into a good map. So I'd suggest you quit while youre relatively ahead, k/o/w.

Well i think although it is a bad idea in some ways, everyone has a different opinion, and if you dont agree with it you dont have to have a go about it, simply post something that you have to offer or dont bother.... no-one is going to rip off your work if you dont post it, so why get **** off about it?

lol, if someone rips a map, it'd be a get the ID and insta perma ban from my server... that's for sure...

and I bet NS could have a flay-moded perma ban for all servers for lowlives like that

i have already had people decompile my original maps and claim it as their own, and well they were never heard from again partially because a aim bomb attack works well, along with several other evil things....

on the other hand ill decompile some maps (im not proud of it) and make my own version of it (usually fix stupid bugs the author left behind, or because they lost the source) of course i give full credit to the author (if i can find the author.)

some decompiles

1. ns_siege909 (author lost source) map made - ns_siege911_rc1
2. freefall4 (misc bugs with info_tfgoal and spawn) map made - freefall4b
3. ns_square_wall (bad hulls for ns 3) map made - ns_square_wall3 (i lost the new one lol)
4. mg386_osp2 (TERRIBLE, HORRIBLE GEOMETRY!) map made - none

authors
1. stark
2. vercon systems
3. squaresoftknight
4. some people in the uk (part of a series)

i never give out source for it though and im again not proud of what i do, but i learn how to accomplish certain effects with ents.

GiGaBiTe: Has the author given you permission to edit his/her map? Or is it just ok to take and decompile a crappy map without asking the author's opinion? Sorry for being offencive, but I just want to know your opinion. I think that one should respect what mapper has done putting together a full map, even if it was a crappy map.

seriously, our source files are like our kids, we create em, smack em around when they dont listen, and when they are just tards, we just give em a little time out ROFL.... im still not giving my sources away.... ever.

Y'know what, screw it.

ns_deus.rar (656kb)

Contains the wad which has been edited with rude words and immature drawings of penises, purely to make sure nobody steals them.

Also, this is by far not a complete map, a few parts of ns_deus ended up in co_dawn, take a look in the map for the bridged corridor, that's the original for co_dawn's hive.

Anyway, it probably won't compile either, it's over the tex limit.

Oh yeah, if i find anyone uses this for a map, i will personally come to your house and break your legs.

Oh oh! Nexus is going to lose the use of his legs!

Be nice.

decompiling to look at the sexy stuff an author did to give you SOME clue as to how he did it - good

Decompling to fix bugs, repair problems, or simply because the author lost the source (WITH author permission)- understandable

Decompiling to fix bugs, repair problems, or simply because you like to- bad

Decomplining to try and "edit" the map and claim it as your own- BANNED. NUKED, CANNED, and forced to watch Teletubbies 24/7 for the rest of your life!



My Example of Decompiling (kudos to whoever found this pic... I dunno where it came from but it was somewhere on this board!)

You people overreacted, to put it kindly. He isn't forcing you to post your map source. Ban yourself from the thread if you don't care for the topic.

Anyway, VHE sucks, and attempts to help new mappers through the program should be welcomed.

Yes, decompiling just gives you the bsp's structure and nothing to do with what was in the original rmf. It basically makes every face in the bsp a brush... which won't tell you anything.

meh, to whoever wants it, the rmf of my abandoned map, co_neo_b10

too small, few paths, but damn sexeh looking stuff (and an awesome secretroom)

PS. if you use any of the stuff in here, give me credit.
If you dont give me credit, i and i meet you someday, i will take your eyes for souveniers

::edit:: unless my brain anticipated this action and took steps to prevent it, this IS my map, just highly compressed

Well... I've spent 10 long and grueling minutes on my contribution to this thread. It's a quality map demonstrating how random floating trigger_hurts set to 9999 damage can enhance your map. It features a readyroom made entirely out of clipbrushes and most of the info_team_starts are overlapping said floating trigger_hurts. It looks best when compiled with -circus, due to the l33tn3ss of the only light on the map being in a box. For best gameplay, it is suggested that once you spawn, you don't move/breathe/look around. To avoid damage to you eyes, this map is best played with your monitor turned off, or thrown in the nearest dumpster.

Here is the .rmf. If anyone uses this in one of their maps, I will point at you and laugh for several hours, then conclude that a) you are blind, b) you are desperate, or c) you are the stupidest lifeform known to exist.

And just to deter any use whatsoever:

thanks to this thread, i found the files for the map i started when i abandoned co_neo.

CURSE YOU, YOU HAVE BROUGHT ME BACK INTO THE PAINFULL WORLD OF MAPPING!!!
(once i have some progress, i will create the standard "look at my map" thread)

To all you guys getting all uppity about this thread.. what the hell? It's not like he's demanding the source to ns_nothing or anything. This looks to me like an equivalent of the "Post Your Pictures" thread. He even posted some of his own sources! I'd certainly post a few things in here if I had anything other than rmfs for current projects.

And as for the claim that no mapper ever releases any open source maps.. I think that Adam Foster and Dave Johnstone might disagree with you.

And just look what happened to him:



But in all seriousness, people have got a bit too worked up about this.

I totally agree with Insane on this. It's like half of you just want an excuse to tell the world how precious your rmfs are to you.

If this sort of thing is to be done, it needs to be done properly. The number one concern of most people that wouldn't mind giving out old crap for people to play with is that they won't be credited for their work. If anyone wants to be taken seriously with this sort of idea, they need to create a database where people enter their work into. The work is checked against previously entered objects to ensure that it is not the work of someone else, or if it is, that it is credited and named appropriately. Categorization, standards, rules, and all sorts of things must be put into place first. If someone enters someone elses work into the database as their own, it has to be as easy as possible to detect this (and correct it!).
This could work for all matter of prefabs, but it certainly won't work by just asking everyone to post their work in a forum. I'm sure you'll find that people would be more willing to give out stuff of higher quality if they feel their work will be safely given due credit.
Of course some people don't care one way or the other, but I think they are a rare breed.