ns_aiah

Could possibly follow the Diamond Layout


or the square sectors layout

Images might not be to intended scale. Some may be intended to be bigger or smaller than they might be shown.

EDIT 4/30/08
Marine Start Concepts (Rough) converted from paper and emboldened by paint


+ 5/01/08
Possible Single or Double Res area with three heigh sectors (high mid low)




Random Map Art
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm5/t0x...tconceptbig.jpg

Comments / suggestions?

interesting concept , but i guess it won't be easy to balance that ^^

I'm not sure about the scale of this map... If it is going to be similar to the official maps in terms of scale, I think 12 Rt's is a bit much, that is usually a number reserved for larger maps.

I like the idea of the uphill and downhill battles for the hive areas (keeping in mind bunny hopping as defensive/offensive means of movement)

The scale of the map, I imagine, would be standard map scale. (Eclipse, Origin, Hera, Tanith, all similarly sized.) As I was drawing marine start in paint, http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm5/t0x...tconceptbig.jpg, I feel like the scale might be a little larger than the average map, which makes me want to redraw marine start, make it a gradient smaller.

Balance hasn't even been worked on. So far, the only considerations for balance I have done is travel times between marine start, and the hypothetical momentum uphill / downhill battles might carry. It could be advantageous for marines to relocate to the ridge, or to rush the descent. Perhaps random chance (1/3 hive locations) will be a deciding factor in alien and marine tactica, aliens initially having tactical advantage until marines know of which hive is occupied.

The corridors and hallways are really much more randomly drawn. However, I know that long corridors favor ranged weapons (marines), so, twisting and tight corridors reduce this ranged potential to the profit of a more balanced combat scenario.

Similarly, no thought has been done on siege positions or fricative assembly (aka choke points).

Twelve resource towers is a bit much, methinks. Perhaps 8 - 10 is a good number. If I remove the RT near marine start, it is compelling for the marines to immediately attempt map control. Distance and time has alot to do with map balance, so, 8 being a nice round yearly number seems nice. Measuring distance between potentials, really. The skulk arrives in 34 seconds to the just finished RT. (for example).

34 seconds for a Skulk is pretty long - check out Tanith, Veil or Eclipse to see what I mean.

Not so sure about the uphill downhill thing being lateral. Height advantage counts for a lot. At the moment the left Hive would be the best Hive to start at because it's downhill towards both MS and Middle, so defending it won't be hard and

Look at the difference between Pipeline and Sub/Cargo Hives in Veil. Apart from the long corridor on the right of Cargo, Cargo is easier to defend because it is flatter. Sub isn't quite as flat but it's still not too hard to defend. Pipe is a ###### because of the height advantage Marines have, meaning Aliens have to travel further (effectively along the hypotenuse of the 'distance/height' lengths if you're a trigonometry fan). This means more time in the air allowing Marines more time to get hits on Aliens, and Marines are less visible because they can use the height advantage as cover.

[Edit] You'll notice that the mapper (KFS) has gone some way to re-balancing this by doing a few things. First, compare the brightness in Pipe to Sub and Cargo, Pipe is a lot darker (you should note that ambient brightness shouldn't be relied on too much to restore balance since any player can nullify this by ramping up their gamma). Second, the Hive is much further away from the main Hive entrances in terms of travel time. By the lift the quickest route forces Marines to crouch, making them incredibly vulnerable due to low mobility and also making them take longer to get to the Hive. On the other side, Marines have a long way to walk from any safe PG spot, especially if they want to get under the Hive to grenade the Gorge healing it on top.

For me, the ideal setup is to have the side Hives with a height advantage and the middle Hive (the one with the advantage of quick links to 2 other Hives) to be flat between itself and MS. Or, have the side Hives level with MS and the middle Hive at a height disadvantage.

The current setup could work, but it would mean you'd have to disadvantage the left Hive somehow and advantage the right Hive. Loads of ways to do this, such as distance to neighbouring res nodes, vents, Alien-friendly corridors, etc..

Beautiful. I love these ideas. And re-arranging the ups/downs. Balance is key...

Your outline says 12 nodes but only has 11. Missing one from the bottom sector i believe.

Best is to aim for 10 nodes. Nodes = money, and more money = more fun, at least when it comes to being deprived of money (bast). Too much and its a b**** to balance (so one team cant dominate).

It seems like a decent plan, except for a few small things. The diamond hive layout (which is pretty much standard, and the one you're using) has the problem of outside hive to outside hive runtimes. Looks like yours would be pretty high as well, though i see some small type of likely alien-only passage in the middle. Perhaps add some vents that cross over between sections.

If you're worried about the middle hive being a shorter distance from MS, why dont you add on its own ascent/descent sector, just without the height change? Then it'll be exactly the same dist, at least on paper.

As for nodes, I find its best to give marines (and each hive) one 'easy' node to cap, then one 'harder' node (which could be another hive, depending on placement), and then have the rest of the map as fair game. Eclipse is the perfect example, and many others follow suit.

True that, my nizzle.


I was thinking skulk/lerk/fade/jp only passage in the middle (broken bridge intersection)


Unsure of this at the moment, but run times are critical.


Good idea. Plus, placement of nodes could compel certain gameplay tactics...

Will post a quick sketch of a rough marine start and surrounding area...

Difficult to decipher that concept art there but I'm sure you know what it all means. I think I can see a dead end corridor there (correct me if I'm wrong). There's nothing wrong with dead ends as long as A) they're very short, and the player loses no more than 1-2 seconds going 'the wrong way' and B) they are badly lit, to indicate they are an unused area of the map. See Bast (around the Engy Hive) for how this can be done effectively.

The wall lines abruptly end becausebecause I haven't gotten to designing the next part of the marine sector... I'm thinking about having the marines "V" split after the initial Marine Start area... I'll probably do more concept art in math lab at school today and I'll post it.

How difficult are NS bots to setup? I've found using AI to test maps (admittedly less complex maps for Advance Wars) quite a help in terms of quickly checking where two teams meet based on spawnpoints and so on. If the bots don't need manual waypoint hinting then it could be quite a useful way to test.

Not sure how long it takes to set them up. But, on the thought of NS bots, I think there should be marine bots that don't move around randomly and work like marines do in Starcraft. They engage enemies as they head to their waypoint, but once they get there they just chill. More control...