My friends, I've been playing NS for too long to care anymore, and there's really only one thing that makes me sad when I see it.

When I started, marines had the advantage, it was obvious. The game just wasn't as well balanced as it could have been, but then, each side had a way to fight back, and it could be both epic and bloody at the same time. But at the same time, when people screwed up, things went downhill. The funny part was, when people screwed up, it wasn't the ones you'd expect. It wasn't the comm, or the gorge, or even the one dropping the hive.

It was the marines. The ones who were supposed to be following orders, but ran off. When I started playing, listening to the comm was paramount, but that's gone now. And because of it, a lot of what made NS what it was is gone. You were forced to work together, to die together, and to scream bloody murder with your gun blazing, surrounded by friends every time you attacked a hive. But that's not there anymore. Now it's all about who is better, who is ahead, and that's not how it should be.

My friends, there is a plague on NS, and I'd like to call all those who see themselves as true marines just to play a few games listening to exactly what the comm says. If he says 'someone' assume it means you, and respond with a 'yes sir' or 'sure thing' or some way to let the comm know you've got it covered. And try your hardest, through death or infestation, to get it done. It doesn't matter if it's a suicide mission, you can spawn back in. Try, for the comms, and for the marines.

Rise, my brothers, and remember that the team isn't you, and it isn't the comm. It's all the marines together, and if you stand strong and listen to the one who can see the whole picture (and make no mistake, he can), you will win.

To the everlasting glory of the infantry!

There always exists some marines who wont follow the order. however, it is well said that the case is worsening. with the introduction of co and a broadened player base, theres no way to stop the tendency of decreasing player quality imho

hmm.. the last sounded a bit like communist, perhaps u should use comrade after all

The average commander is about as talented as the russian leadership after stalins purges, thank you but id rather desert than run towards an obvious death that wont accomplish anything.

Maybe it won't, maybe it will. You don't know the plan. Remember, you do respawn. Is it so bad to send one marine out to die, if it distracts the aliens from an attempt to get a phase gate outside a hive? And if you refuse that order, the others trying to get the phase die?

Sounds selfish to me.

And I don't really care if it sounds a bit communist, that's a system that only works on paper, but following orders works in practice. It is the single most important thing to the marine team. I don't even know why I'm posting again, this is only a plea. Take it as you will, all I'm asking is that a few more people try a little bit more.

people that pub excusively or play in some ###### clans yet consider themselves pro won't follow orders, ever. they cant follow orders in a scrim, how could they possibly do it on a pub.

newbies wont follow orders because they dont understand them. "weld the pg at lessthanthree spot and mine it then go sg overlook rt then run under cargo to get a pg". ns slang isnt that easy to pick up, and even if you understood that sentence you wouldnt be able to execute it if you cant aim

finally we have the players that understand whatever the comm wants to get done and know how to get it done. most of the time though these people know the game better than your stock pub commander and therefore wont follow his orders

Then ban them. It's very simple, you ban players who are not condusive to good games. If this means immaturity, arrogant clanners, failure to play as a team, whatever. It's not south america's fault if mexico fails to control the influx of immigration. It's mexico's.

We don't have very many admins anymore who care about strategy or good games. They just want to run around and shoot things. They ought to be playing counterstrike.

there are people who are recapping rts for u when u r sieging without u telling them to do so.. they dun necessarily be pro but they know u r in trouble sieging when u have only 2 rts left. u will be glad that there is one and only one of them who dun listen to comms order but doing good for the team

tell me on what server u r an admin and i will ban the server instead QFT

banning players based on subjective arguments is pretty infantile

if you want strategy and tactics blended in your ns experience then join a clan (a good clan)

Ok, no. That's BS. There's no way to eliminate that kind of depreciation, but that doesn't mean you can't appreciate too and balance or even improve.

Yes the game is older than it was and so you have a lot of skilled players and a percentage of them will always be SoB's.

However, a good admin presence and a server environment where realism and immersion are encouraged can really bring it in.

I do this when ever I run my listen server. The problem is that it's hard to find those players and it's hard to find good servers with an admin presence. I mean I can turn on my server right now, Asal, and give you a great "old school" NS experience... But with what people? I can't get enough of you good people on. When I was testing 3.2 today I had at max 7 ppl on the server. And that only happened when I had at least 3. People search through the Steam lists for a something fun and avoid empty servers that might actually be great.

And then the majority of your NS servers have poor admin presence. And some of those admins are ###### who aren't about giving their clients a good NS experience like they should.

To be honest the server and admins (which includes myself) are more are fault than the developers in my opinion. And we don't have enough of you all joining good servers. It's always one of the jam packed combat servers that people rush to it seems...

I'm with you Asal but you got to support good servers out there with playing in them.

PM me the name and IP of your server, I'll play there. I'll do what I can to help, and try to bring the people I know as well. Maybe we can get a good following going. I'd rather you not post it here because this isn't for advertisement, of course.

But there is some point to that. I just hope that with all the objections and arguing here, people realize that all I'm asking is for people to try listening to orders and being nice to the comm for once. At least a 'nt' or a 'nice try' if the comm loses, at the end? We're dealing with people, after all. It's not like they're trying to lose. They do their best, same as you. Let them know you appreciate it?

see sig. quality players. folks who follow orders.

play pugs or in clans if you want the marines using teamwork, that being said the clan scene is withering

A commander with a good mic will instantly gain the attention of his marines.

I said it in my Commander Guide in larger terms:

* as a comm, be a good rine first.
* follow orders ALWAYS. If you follow orders and lose its the comms fault. If you do not follow orders it could be yours.
* noone will follow your orders as a comm if you never followed theres.

Some of us can't comm effectively no matter what, but that's a good point. You can't help the team if you don't follow orders well, and you may very well be the reason your team loses.

Are you suggesting I should follow orders I know to be wrong, especially when I know the correct move, can execute it and save the game from certain disaster?

* follow orders ALWAYS. If you follow orders and lose its the comms fault. If you do not follow orders it could be yours.
* noone will follow your orders as a comm if you never followed theres.


Thoughed it was clear.. yes you should.

Aslong as the comm is in the chair and not voted out, he gives the orders. You can't possibly know what a comm is thinking. Besides you are never gona convince a new comm his way was 'bad' if he does not lose and see for himself.

We all make mistakes, we all have to learn. And you can be sure that if I am comming and ppl don't follow orders they better either eject or start listening cause else some are gona be very left out.

Actually? Yes. I would. If you don't like the order, suggest what you think would be better, but do as you're told unless the comm changes his mind in lue of your suggestion. How else is someone supposed to learn? He's just going to be annoyed at you if you don't listen to orders, and then he certainly won't.

When I pubbed, I would follow orders only if I knew that they could not be achieved without my intervention. Veteran players are pretty much 5 steps ahead of your average pub comm, in a different league of thought almost. The problem is stupid useless players who don't follow orders but just run around and get killed repeatedly. Unfortunately they don't visit these forums to hear your pleas.

Actually I'm wrong. They aren't completely useless. They load up on ammo to 250/30 and leave that lying around the map for the pro players to pick up. Free ammo drops.

and because you do NOT listen to the comm you show them how its NOT done. Hence they go mimic you and die for your free ammo packs.

I prefer we all listen, they learn, and have some pro matches like we used to in the old days.

This attitude is a big problem on pub servers. Often times the players with the most skill are the ones who listen the least. The problem with that? If you have the most skill, you are probably the best person to have at whatever WP is being given.

Noobs don't listen because they don't understand the order or the value of the following orders. Pros don't because they think they are too good. So, practically no one follows orders. What's the point of having a comm or even attempting organized teamwork when the "best" players don't encourage it?

Well, to be a com, its like in real life...if you wanna lead, you gotta prove in a way that you demand respect and that your smart enough to be a com.

What helps...

1st, Don't com first game, or always go com, or say : sorry I only com. You have to prove yourself on the field first to gain respect from good players

2nd Have a microphone, act cool, be friendly and smart

3rd You need to be fast, a too slow com that doesn't use keyboard can lose respect pretty fast around good players

I for myself don't always follow all orders...but I don't act stupid. or at least distract the enemy...going all the other way then where your com wants to develop can be a great thing. When I'm com, I'm happy when I got smart players that don't need for me to command them and just ask stuff like bullets pg's, what ever.

And yes, not all coms are smart too...yeah maybe i'm an ######, but I won't always do what they want. I won't build a 5th siege turrret, no sorry...stuff like that lol

But I understand how you feel about it all, how players don't always listen, yeah I guess it's annoying, but
it's pubs. I don't ask for more, I just do my best to make the team win, that's all.

"You can't possibly know what a comm is thinking. Besides you are never gona convince a new comm his way was 'bad' if he does not lose and see for himself."

Yes you can, most pubbers are as predictable as the clock.

Are we talking bout the same game? Of course you can not just predict a comms actions. Especially if its a newbie. Newbies lack experience and do.. rather unusuall things. I know you can kinda predict this, but thats also the case with experienced comms.But kinda predict is not 'for sure'.

I have played pub matches where we won because the comm was new. He made such odd desitions the aliens did not know how to counter and we used that. (the rines in the field where far from new)

9/10 times, the commander is thinking "If I can get turrets in the hives, we win!"

I can emphasize with both sides here, since I do comm occasionally. I don't follow all orders the commander gives, because I know they're futile or something else more important needs to be done, and nobody else is doing it. If the commander is throwing unequipped marines continually against the second hive and not even close to setting up sieges/breaking through, you bet I'll recap the lost nodes and get a PG in the 3rd hive before we lose that too. I think this is the best solution - follow orders that are reasonable. If you are the commander and your team finds your orders unreasonable, you should convince them that they are sound.

I miss the 1.0x days when you could give a marine to waypoint to guard himself. It made the sprite appear infront of them usually taking up the vast portion of the vision, it would also be hell on their frames per second making things all laggy.


A good comm with a mic will get things cracking for sure.

In pubs the comm doesn't even need to talk. I just hit C and do what needs to be done, it's not that hard to know without the comm telling you. Usually the comm has down syndrome and makes stupid calls so I choose not to listen to them.

It's more fun to rush the hive over and over anyways.



I like to think that the other 10 marines will go to that wp and get it done, while I go off and do something else. You always gotta be doing 2 things at once on marines if you want to win.

I suppose that's my only hope, from reading what's on these boards. Of all the responses here, we've got what...two people who support listening to the comm?

Does anyone else find this not only sad, but distressing? This makes me want to cry.

Personally, I allways listen.

I dislike how elitist players think they should go spawn camp the aliens (and ruin the game) instead of listening to the commander (and maybe have a good game?).

God forbid good players using a legitimate game tactic to efficiently bring victory to their team.

i can pretty much determine from the first 30 seconds how someone is going to comm the rest of the game. at that point i decide whether hes someone that knows what to do and deserves to be listened to or not. dont get me wrong, ill have sympathy for him and ill get rts up if, as sarisel said, i know that if i dont do it then no-one else will. let me ask you a question: how many of the people complaining here actually ever check their hud/minimap/scoreboard?

and now heres just something to break the argument down for all of you:

good clanners will take in and process more information about the game than the rest of the team combined. the level of situational awareness and long-sightedness amongst these players is just something so much above your average pubber that it is, understandably, difficult to comprehend. this isnt because theyre smarter than anyone else, but because theyve played this game ishloads more and on a higher level of competition. pub rounds are so godawfully predictable that i dont understand why anyone would be satisfied with just them

Going straight to the overall goal of the game is obviously not a legitimate game tactic.


I usually don't listen to the comm. That's because I'm more useful gaining positioning, foaling ambushes, and trapping higher lifeforms than I am sitting in a hive building turrets because the comm thinks that they'll win the game that way. I go where I feel I'm needed, if it happens to coincide with an area that the comm wants to take, great, if not, I'm pretty sure I have a better idea of what should be getting done than pub comms. Even when the commander is a competitive commander, I still probably wouldn't listen to them.

Most commanders are awful. They don't multi-task, they don't drop weapons to players who need them (Please, please, do not drop the 2-8 marine a shotgun, drop the 8-2 player a shotgun, be selective with your res), and they can't effectively push a second hive on time. Good commanders immediately gain the respect of marines under them in a very short period of time, I don't ask people to go to x, I tell them to go to x, and they usually do it. If you have a weenie voice or sound like a pushover, people aren't going to listen to you. A lot of people won't listen to screaming lunatics either, it takes an even hand to win over most pub games. If you show initiative and that you know what you're doing, a lot of people will listen.

Work with players that you have, not the players you want. A lot of good players are going to play the game themselves, they don't need you telling them what to do. Just do as they ask (within reason) and they are pretty capable of winning the game themselves. A shotgun or HMG for the 19-1 player on your team is a good investment, its very likely that player can solo half the alien team without much help. Send a bad player with them that has a welder, tell them to just weld that good player and shoot if the good player is reloading. Use the players you have to your advantage and the game becomes a lot more entertaining as a commander.

kinda agree that its a place where you must command (hence commander) not ask, but sometimes asking helps.

But like I said, play on servers you play on regularly and they will know you. Most follow my orders with ease, whereether is cause they know I can comm, know what I am doing, or simply will ignore a rine with weapons and meds if they fail to obey orders twice.

Yeah I agree Adj. I'm not biased when it comes to commanders. If you're good, I'll listen. If you're not, I won't. Regardless of who you are.

I remember this one guy from G4B2S named Priestly. I never knew the guy before, but he commed a couple games, and knew what he was doing. I fallowed his orders because he gave good orders, even though I never saw the guy play before.

I comm and I don't actually give any orders except every now and then like "smelter growing PG at waypoint now thank you." or slap a waypoint on some nodes that should of been capped that haven't. You can't seriously command public because not everyone plays on the same wavelength, even clanners aren't clever enough to always listen to me, and I'm not clever enough to see how every scenario plays out when my team is filled with randoms. The way to command public is throw the dice and hope your marines turn up where you want, if they don't poke them there, for the most part they can figure it out with only a tiny bit of direction that I would give in a competitive match.

As for listening to comms, I judge by his ability whetever or not he's worthy of listening. Base layout, speed of response, whetever he meds through engagements or simply responds to calls after, hell, even how quickly he lays down the IP armoury is a big indicator of ability; Always nice to know your comm knows the hotkeys and isn't going to be dropping things at a rate of 1 a minute. That all being said, given my experience as a commander it's unlikely that unless it's b1, buggeh, peach, adj or another top tier comm in the CC they simply won't know more than me and if they tell me something that I don't think will work I'll avoid it. Yeh maybe my presence might help it succeed somehow, but I'd sooner make what I know to be right happen than risk a lost cause.

I keep saying, play on servers you know and where ppl know you. I saw alot of ppl from the forum on some servers I play, and I am known by some clanners who also tend pubs. I have no trouble with a game when those ppl are online. They know me, I know them and we can all have fun.

Quantity has a quality of it's own

Edit: Now when it comes to playing on public I pretty much do what whoever said it does, I check the minimap and figure out what needs to be done. If an order is given I check if I need to help out, if I'm able to at the moment, and then decide whether to go there or to act as a three man pressure team somewhere else myself. If the commander really stinks and I'm the only reasonable player on the team I usually just try to position myself between that hive they're sillily trying to lock down and leech RfK and prevent my team from getting killed.

currently skill on pubs is so low.

yesterday I had a few matches on a pub server and actually felt sad as to how low skill was.
if 1 min ingame every rine under your command gets oned by skulks while rines travel in medpacked groups, theres not anything you can do about it.

those matches were horrid and kinda uberstacked so it seemed.

Yes what about the comms that actually give specific players or groups of players WPs? In that case there isn't 10 other rines that could do the job.

Don't get me wrong, I like it when very good players take initiative or give me advice. I almost always listen. The problem comes when I want them to listen to me. I've had "pro" players refuse to listen to orders even they think are good. Just a few nights ago for example:

A good player managed to get to a perfect seige spot to take out the alien's 2nd hive (on his own initiative). He builds the PG. I drop a TF and order the rest of the team to get there and build while he guards...then I guess he got bored and left once just ONE other marine got there. Before the rest of the team could get through the PG the one average skill player was killed by a skulk. Now the rest of the team proceeds to get meat grindered as they phase in one by one and I had to recycle. If that "pro" had just stayed where he WAS needed instead of going where he THOUGHT he was needed we woulda had the hive.

and thats why I say... listen always.. I know one rine needs to do other stuff, I will ask that specific rine.