Why not have some 1337 modler take the lerk bite model, get rid of the, um, whatever you call ems that you shoot the spikes out of, and have it replace the skulk model. It would still block a good deal of the screen but not so much that you can't tell where your target is. Not looking for a flame war here, and I really don't give a damn for anyone who feels it necesarry to say "Well that's exploiting so you shouldn't do it". Unless it's something helpful or saying "Hey, I'm sweet and I love you so I did it!", don't say anything. Kthx bibi.

QUOTE (Fopher @ Nov 10 2002, 11:22 AM)

Why not have some 1337 modler take the lerk bite model, get rid of the, um, whatever you call ems that you shoot the spikes out of, and have it replace the skulk model. It would still block a good deal of the screen but not so much that you can't tell where your target is. Not looking for a flame war here, and I really don't give a damn for anyone who feels it necesarry to say "Well that's exploiting so you shouldn't do it". Unless it's something helpful or saying "Hey, I'm sweet and I love you so I did it!", don't say anything. Kthx bibi.

it's been stated that it's an exploit and aconsidered a cheat by the devs. so no.

Tsk Tsk....... Necro, he specifically asked that you did not remind him of the fact that it is an exploit and a cheat

I would like a quote on that necro-

as has been said, the devs don't want anyone to do it, so it's unlikely that even if someone does it again, it'll be posted here.

quote plz?

QUOTE (Necro- @ Nov 10 2002, 08:06 AM)

it's been stated that it's an exploit and aconsidered a cheat by the devs. so no.

wrong necro- not a cheat just and exploit

QUOTE

I don't consider this a cheat, but it's definitely an exploit. Realize that any skills you get while using these special binds or models will be thrown out the window in any competitive environment because they won't be allowed. Tournament rules don't allow custom binds and they'll enforce model consistency. You can learn to play NS, or you can learn to play your own version of NS, it's your choice.

Give this guy s break, hes not asking for a model with no teeth on it, hes asking for the lerk mouth to be used for the skulk.

So he wont be able to use it on a competitive level?

necro you jump at people way to much

"holier then thou"

Bob, it's an exploit that gives him an advantage over other players. The cheat/exploit angle is just semantics. would you loke ot be on the receiving end?
read this thread. it's ade pretty clear.
http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...=ST&f=19&t=8388

sounds fine to me, help brush up on my skills for when I play in the real league

QUOTE (Bob the Alien @ Nov 10 2002, 02:35 PM)

I would like a quote on that necro-

look around, the devs have said it many times.

QUOTE

Bob, it's an exploit that gives him an advantage over other players. The cheat/exploit angle is just semantics.

Yes, but Fina's Hive sight skin also makes it easier to see stuff in hive sight, so would that not be a cheat?

And a skin that makes guns brighter, would they not also be a cheat?

You wanted a quote, so here it is.

Altering or removing the skulk or lerk bite model is an exploit. There are degrees of exploitation, and this one falls in the middle of severity - enough to make some people really upset at you if they were to find out what you were doing, and it is one that would definitely not be allowed in tournament play (I'm not talking about public servers here). Altering other things, like skins to make guns brighter, are also exploits, but are less offensive. Changing player skins to bright clown colors is an exploit, and a rather serious one. Changing crosshairs or hivesight sprites could be considered an exploit, but typically a very, very minor one (possibly/probably acceptable). So, to make it simple for everyone, let me define what an exploit is in general terms so that there won't be any confusion.

Exploit: Any alteration of the stock game/mod that provides the one player with any kind of non-skill based advantage that is not immediately available through use of normal, built-in game settings to other players. Just because an exploit is available for download somewhere, this -does not- mean that the exploit is fair to use. Purely aesthetic alterations (eg: new models, sprites, skins, etc.) that are strictly for the purpose of user preference and can not provide any significant advantage to the player, while still distasteful for the developers, are -not- exploits.

By the way, I don't care what everyone's semantic differences are regarding exploits versus cheats, but I can tell you this. If you were to attend a CPL tournament, and you were caught using altered/removed bite models, you would be disqualified due to cheating.

Clear enough?

QUOTE

Purely aesthetic alterations (eg: new models, sprites, skins, etc.) that are strictly for the purpose of user preference

In otherwords you cant do anything about cheaters, so youll call the rest of us who want easier-to-use models cheaters in stead?

You conveniently omitted the last half of that quoted sentence.

This: http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...ST&f=19&t=10054
is not an exploit. Changing or removing the bite models to make it easier for you to see (read: gives you an advantage) is an exploit. How hard is that to understand?

Oh, and if we REALLY wanted to, we most certainly could do something to prevent this type of exploit. We're waiting to see how much of a problem it will be.

Just for a simple referance, cheating and exploiting are the same. Both are classified when you have an unfair advantage over the opposing players. Both do this.

Close topic.

Sprites, such as changes crosshairs or hivesight things with different colors provide you with no better advantage than someone not using them. I can use the normal ones perfectly, and I can tell wtf is going on. Saying an editted sprite that's a new color is an advantage is absurd.

Now, if this was CS and instead of a steady xhair, you had one that spread open, making it a little tougher to find the exact middle, it would clearly be an exploit, but changing the colors on your crosshair or the blips from hivesight, waypoints, or motion tracking is hardly an exploit.

Everyone can see them just fine, just some like a small distinction, not all the same color. This doesn't provide them with anything better than someone not using them, so it can't be classified as an exploit or a cheat. Granted they may not be allowed to use them in a league, but then again, my pistol is tinted red, and that couldn't be used in a league, so not ALL things disallowed by leagues are not cheats/exploits.

Some people need to brush up on the definitions, as not all leagues are as stubborn, and especially not all tournies. Choosing one to fit your argument doesn't prove one way or the other, you've only given 1 example.

This though could easily be considered one. They've already stated, in a matter of words, that altering the models so you can see more while attacking (this includes muzzleflashes) is an exploit. And I wouldn't be suprised if some file consistency went in because of this. This will indeed ruin skinners fun, as I was hoping for a mouth with a green inside and partially rotted teeth, but if file consistency is added in, I've got no chance to see that happen. The skulks view hardly makes it hard to land on your target. The pre-patch problem was the lag and people skipping across the floor, making it very hard to land a hit, but now, it's insanely easy. Please, don't ruin a large chunk of the customization of the mod cuz you want someone which has already been labeled an exploit.

It's amazing how I can specifically state that I don't want to hear any whining and crying about how you think it's an exploit, and yet i get at least 10 posts about it. Did I not make myself clear enough? If nobody wants to do it, then hell, I'll do it myself albeit it might take some time, but at least I won't have any moral qualms about releasing it to the public so everyone who hates the bite model can do away with it. For me the game's about fun, and it's not fun missing the first bite and never finding out where they ran again because in the time I spend looking for them again, I've just been filled with 3 pounds of lead because I missed once as the fastest alien class.

Well that's good to know, that you have no moral quams about cheating. "I'm going to stab you in the gut and steal all your ball as you lay on the ground bleeding, I don't want to hear any whining and crying about how you think it's an exploit!!!"

Fopher, if you miss with skulk, you DESERVE to be shot and killed. If you actually took the time to learn, it's not hard to just TIME your bites instead of trying to rely on something that has already been considered and exploit by the ns team.

If you go ahead and do it yourself, you're cheating. Plain and simple. No excuse.

And I've learned something helpfull to play as skulk. Bind jump key to something on the mouse because jump is the key to making a skulk hard to shoot. You don't need the mouth model changed to kill effectively. For the first couple of days I played without jumping and was killed everytime I encountered a marine. Now I jump nonstop while attacking and usually take two or more marines down inside their base with turrets built. Its amazing difference that jump key makes.

Is this post unnrelated?

Well I'm one of the best alien players around from end-game screenshots I have, either that or I just play with people that have no idea what to do. Some end scores I've had are 80-2, 57-12, and 63-8. Obviously, I don't need any "cheats" as you dub it, it's just a cosmetic change as far as I'm concerned. And by saying it is cheating, you're basically saying that the entire lerk model is a cheat model since you can see aroudn when you bite. Well this topic will probably be locked soon because the mods can't handle having an opinion that differs from the majority view, so that's probably the last I'll say about it. Gotta get working on it on my own, I'll put up a link if I finish.

QUOTE (Fopher @ Nov 10 2002, 07:35 PM)

Gotta get working on it on my own, I'll put up a link if I finish.

Your model change won't work once consistancy checking goes in. It would be a shame to see you work so hard for nothing.

I have a better idea. Since you really know how to make a mod better then the the NS team, why not make your own?

I'm not even going to bother. the team, and the decent folk in the community, agree that this is exploiting and giving unfair advantage, therefore, stfu, there;s not muc more to be said.

word!

Maybe the team will change them a little in r2. Til then, please stop this nonsense.