The OFFICIAL Twitter Discussion Thread, For all news/topics/ideas related to the Twitter feed. Options

[rsd]

I think I read Max made some auto-updater program for the game which I guess wouldn't be needed if they were using Steam?

I hope they use Steam. Repsitory for my games, Friends works well, easy to get a large audience.

Nope. Max made an auto updater for the tools. I'm quite sure they will distribute it over Steam - would be crazy not to.

[Zeno]

I wonder how they want to port the game to Mac/Linux if they bind it to steam permanently. IF there is going to be a port then maybe a non-steam version will exist.
Maybe UWE should offer the game as a non-steam download, too like 2dBoy does with their World of goo. They could save the percentage that Valve gets, too .
Or maybe UWE can get Valve to release a Mac/linux version of Steam but i rahter doubt that Valve will do it.

[Max]

I wonder how they want to port the game to Mac/Linux if they bind it to steam permanently. IF there is going to be a port then maybe a non-steam version will exist.
Maybe UWE should offer the game as a non-steam download, too like 2dBoy does with their World of goo. They could save the percentage that Valve gets, too .
Or maybe UWE can get Valve to release a Mac/linux version of Steam but i rahter doubt that Valve will do it.

It's very likely we will have a non-Steam version that you can get directly from us in addition to a Steam version.

[steppin'razor]

Where can I pre-order N2? Is it listed on steam yet?

Nothing has been released about pre-ordering NS2 yet

This post has been edited by steppin'razor: Apr 9 2009, 04:43 PM

[Raza.]

It's very likely we will have a non-Steam version that you can get directly from us in addition to a Steam version.

Awesome!

[juice]

I think I'll buy a steam and non-steam version. lol

[Raza.]

Charlie checked out KFS' mockups of an isometric Commander camera.

Are you going to implement (Diablo like) see-through walls, so one can still drop meds on people close to walls?

[moultano]

Are you going to implement (Diablo like) see-through walls, so one can still drop meds on people close to walls?

That would be a neat idea. I wonder if you could implement that deep in the renderer by not running occlusion culling for the commander, then using a pixel shader that takes any world geometry and renders any overdraw with an alpha component. Could be a neat way of getting all obstructions out of the way, not just neighboring walls.

[KungFuSquirrel]

Are you going to implement (Diablo like) see-through walls, so one can still drop meds on people close to walls?

It really shouldn't change anything from NS1. I was actually surprised how far I could push the pitch without breaking things - it's still subtle, but more exaggerated than I thought would work. The only real difference might be panning your view 'down' a bit to get someone on screen that, with a straight-down angle, would be visible already. As long as you're on the back side of a polygon, you should be able to drop items through it just like you did in NS1. Every other major case should be able to be handled by func_seethrough or its NS2 equivalent.

However, moultano might be on to something as well. I think personally I would still prefer having the per-object and per-face control, but it's definitely an interesting idea.

This post has been edited by KungFuSquirrel: Apr 9 2009, 07:40 PM

[moultano]

However, moultano might be on to something as well. I think personally I would still prefer having the per-object and per-face control, but it's definitely an interesting idea.

Personally, I'd rather the engine do it all. Not having to worry about this would be really liberating as a mapper to build rooms with epic architecture.

[KungFuSquirrel]

Personally, I'd rather the engine do it all. Not having to worry about this would be really liberating as a mapper to build rooms with epic architecture.

The problem is, there are still some obstructions you want. Small bits of level-over-level still work normally by way of the commander parallax giving access to the area underneath. With a blanket pixel shader, would this still be an option? How would it handle a ledge that from certain angles would obstruct the floor beneath it? What if while you have one room centered on your screen, another room at another elevation is visible enough that it blocks some of your interactions with the current room? There's also a lot of fine control over the visual presentation of commander mode that would be lost.

I've had plenty of lively debates with programmers over whether or not certain things should be automated (especially when it comes to spawning and controlling AI in SP situations), it's amusing how polar opposite the viewpoints tend to be Generally speaking the best targets for automation are under-the-hood things that don't dramatically impact gameplay or visuals, such as Max's occlusion culling. For a case like this that can impact both gameplay and visual presentation, I think it'll be best left in the hands of the level designer.

Also, with the new editor I don't anticipate there being any trouble getting complex geometry to work with a func_seethrough equivalent, and I've been pondering a few simple interface suggestions that might make it even quicker.

This post has been edited by KungFuSquirrel: Apr 9 2009, 09:40 PM

[Fraxinus]

Are you going to implement (Diablo like) see-through walls, so one can still drop meds on people close to walls?

There was a 2D MMO I used to play when I was younger (RO) that had something similar to that, where you could lower the opacity of things like columns in caves or dungeons. It was a useful feature, and in NS2 it could save the complications of the commander having to change the rotation of the angle he is viewing the map at.

[killkrazy]

what about, for the see-through wall issues, players that are behind any kind of object are shown as a coloured halo/aura... like in L4D ?

[KuBaN]

Also, with the new editor I don't anticipate there being any trouble getting complex geometry to work with a func_seethrough equivalent, and I've been pondering a few simple interface suggestions that might make it even quicker.

Might we be moving towards the possibility of multiple floors? In the The Sims 2 a button click could hide or reveal the ceiling, roof, walls, etc. of an entire floor, revealing/hiding the floor below it. I know this wasn't possible in NS1 due to the limitations of the engine, but it doesn't seem to impossible now.

[moultano]

The problem is, there are still some obstructions you want. Small bits of level-over-level still work normally by way of the commander parallax giving access to the area underneath. With a blanket pixel shader, would this still be an option? How would it handle a ledge that from certain angles would obstruct the floor beneath it? What if while you have one room centered on your screen, another room at another elevation is visible enough that it blocks some of your interactions with the current room? There's also a lot of fine control over the visual presentation of commander mode that would be lost.

That's a good point, though I'd argue that you'd only ever want surfaces to obstruct other surfaces if it is possible to drop things on them. You might have enough information at rendering time if you had the surface normal (as opposed to the per-pixel normal) available in a buffer to test against. So for instance, if the surface isn't nearly vertical it would always turn transparent when occluding another surface, but if the surface is nearly flat it would stay solid. You'd still need a little mapper work for flat things in high places, but that could cut down the load a lot.

I've had plenty of lively debates with programmers over whether or not certain things should be automated (especially when it comes to spawning and controlling AI in SP situations), it's amusing how polar opposite the viewpoints tend to be Generally speaking the best targets for automation are under-the-hood things that don't dramatically impact gameplay or visuals, such as Max's occlusion culling. For a case like this that can impact both gameplay and visual presentation, I think it'll be best left in the hands of the level designer.

I've been working on a tool to try to automate the creation of texture assets, so I think you know what side of the debate I come down on.

[schkorpio]

so when do we see these mock ups


will the isometric camera impede on level design?

[6john]

Allow content creators to work they way they want to work -- don't impose a specific pipeline

sp?

[ChromeAngel]

NS2: Charlie changed Commander rendering to be isometric and with a shorter field of view (60 degrees). Looks awesome...great idea Andrew!

Pictures please

[smikolai]

Charlie loves board games and he keeps mentioning Power Grid.

Pick up a copy, it's good stuff.

[daidalos]

Hey, I've got a question about the Linux version.
Are you going to do it like ID and Epic that you release the retail version of the game for Windows with the exception that Linux users can buy that same version to but will have to wait a few days/weeks (in Epic's case maybe months or years) until you finish the installer so they can play it too or are you planning on releasing two different versions?