Allready mapping for NS2?, ns_eclipse 2.0 (sourcified) Options

[Maxunit]

Thanks Corporal

I indeed have fun mapping this nice baby, but it takes much time, to get it done correctly :omg:

I will show more stuff in the next few days. Currently im trying to get more screenies from the map from different views etc pp.

[Ahnteis]

But then the fact appears, that no map is copyrighted at all

All works of art are automatically copyright. There is no need to apply or register for copyright. Copyright probably does apply to a specific map, but you might get away with making a new map based on an old one.

It would be polite AND prudent, however, to ask the original author if he:
a) minds
b) is already making an updated version

[Maxunit]

Sure, I had some kind of another style for ns_eclipse in mind now. Will work on a new version. I will try to get some concept drawing done first, then I will work on the map (but there will be serveral parts taken from ns_eclipse 2.x or 3.x). I will write the original mapper a mail, before I will start on this now.

[Gaidan]

you need to change the name no matter what you do, so NS_Verbodus. =P

[Maxunit]

If this map name is not in use, then i will use it I tried to contact the mapper, who made ns_eclipse via ICQ, no success so far, or I will write him a mail or pm.

[Goldenprize]

lol:
"HACKED BY ALEMIN K**LI WWW.TURKPROTEST.***"
"http://images.filesources.de" was hacked...

This post has been edited by Goldenprize: May 31 2007, 01:08 PM

[Maxunit]

Noticed it, will fix this. There is currently and allround imagehosting hack going around.

Fixed:

No can do about this. I know a polish hacker, but he wont tell me, how this hack works, that can hack every image host.

This post has been edited by Maxunit: Jun 1 2007, 12:45 AM

[schkorpio]

i mentioned this in the i&s forums -why dont you make it eclipse part 2, as in don't copy it, make it look like a huge battle took place - ns2 is the war. so map what could have happened on eclipse during ns1

[KungFuSquirrel]

I think that's even the wrong way to look at it - Eclipse or any other map with simply a cosmetic adjustment likely won't cut it.

My original post was commenting on how you don't known the game mechanics to NS2 yet and we don't know the level support + requirements. I personally believe mapping shouldn't start in true (intending to release the map) until we have confirmed Alien classes and abilities combined with Confirmed Marine armors (may be more then 3) and buildings. Also we have no idea what the economy looks like right now.

This is spot-on.

I'm flattered that anyone would take it upon themselves to try and re-make any level I've done for a new engine (hell, I've taken smaller steps toward doing so myself), but I also don't think it's a great idea at this stage for an NS2 map. There's no telling what features or gameplay NS2 may bring - it may be identical, or it may be radically different. Perhaps different enough that Eclipse or any other NS1 map just simply doesn't work anymore.

I don't want to rain on any parades, but Charlie's always had some very lofty goals for NS2, and while it's yet to be seen where it lands, stuff like the announced dynamic infestation and lua scripting setup implies some big changes already. A lot of people have talked remakes of old maps, and that's exciting for those of us who have contributed them, but I think it's almost a disservice to what NS2 could be.

I have a series of sketches and rough layout bits here for what I'd imagine Eclipse II to be based on what I know of NS2 so far; the first thing I did putting these together was throw out virtually everything about Eclipse save for a focused layout and certain visual signatures (i.e. the thick wall supports found through much of the level, skylights, and the triad/keyhole style energy thingies). I'd encourage anyone currently thinking about making a remake of a NS1 map to do the same - keep in mind the things you like, whether in the layout or visually, and think about how to make it bigger and better. Then, as more info comes out about NS2 and what it'll be, it'll be more clear what direction(s) to take within a level for it.

That said, if you continue with this best of luck to you. It is up to Charlie how remakes will be handled (if at all), and be prepared for the possibility more than one person might feel like doing such a remake, but as far as I'm concerned it's definitely a compliment that anyone wants to take a stab at a map of mine and I'd be curious how someone else might approach it.

[Buzzou]

Ihell, I've taken smaller steps toward doing so myself

wow that looks awesome!

but yeah he's right, you guys should at least wait until they release that NS2TR thingy or whatever its called...

also, considering flayra will be purchasing the maps this time around, he would probably favour the original makers of the maps, or at least someone that has permission from the map maker to redo it, and maybe split the $$$. you've got to remember theres money involved this time around.

but i guess that wont stop anyone from making some custom maps when its released

[schkorpio]

looks very nice kFS

pitty valve are stilling using hammer. the Doom 3 editor makes life a lot easier. - especially when it comes to lighting since you can try a few things realtime, or even in game.

Also a pitty hl2 doesn't compare to d3 detail wise.

This post has been edited by schkorpio: Jun 4 2007, 07:56 AM

[Kassinger]

And perhaps it's better to try to make a map of your own first than to start with a remake of one of the most popular NS1 maps. :P

Certainly you can learn a lot from remaking other people's maps, but if you are considering releasing it for NS2, maybe you should work on something of your own creation?

[wankalot]

yes... you must keep in mind that the the way the game works could change DRAMATICALLY. For example.. imagine there were dynamic hive locations for example. you would need to build maps with higher ceilings. If there was dynamic infestation you would have to make doorways and corridors wider. But thats just a start.... keep up the good work but id wait till tech release until u do MAJOR work.

Ps: Asking for permission is not about copyright... its courtesy.

[StixNStonz]

I think this is a really bad idea, tbh.

First off, theres a really good chance that you're fairly new to mapping. I mean, you couldve taken that MS that you built, quickly textured it, quickly lit, and done a quick compile, and it would have looked infinitely better, and only taken an extra 30 mins. If you're not extremely comfortable with mapping yet, you should probably not try to remake *the* most popular NS map, especially when its expected to get huge visual updates along with whatever else.

2nd. This happened a lot with CS:Source, and you know what happened to every single one of those remakes? There were about 20 militia remakes, a Train one, Assault, etc. They were almost all done by intermediate mappers who probably spent a whole lot of time on them. Some remakes even had really quality amateur mappers remake them; one version of Militia was pretty damn sweet, with very original gameplay and visual updates.
...But within one to a few months, each of the maps got official versions released. The community versions were immediately forgotten about. Go look at the new Militia. Its unbelievable. Then go download any of the dozens of amateur attempts. They will never see the light of day again.

Thats a horrible fate for a mapper. If the task of remaking Eclipse is up for grabs, there will probably be numerous attempts, and by very able mappers.

So what im getting at, is... it would be a lot better if you looked at Eclipse or whatever other maps you like, and figured out what it is about them that you like. Understand the theory of the architecture, the gameplay that it creates. Wander around every map and do this. Once you understand how NS mapping creates different types of gameplay, you can then apply this to something of your own.. something original.

And if something is original, it wont be rendered instantly obsolete as soon as another mapper comes up with a better version than yours. Heck, your own map could become the next Eclipse

This post has been edited by StixNStonz: Jun 4 2007, 09:52 PM

[Archfiendchris]

I hate to say it but i agree with him. Make your own map

-Draw it out, plan for awesome visual effects

- Make map

- Become the new success with your own fans

- If it's a extreme favorite the original creator , friend or a good map maker will prob. make a better one. Exactly how he said with cs.

Not trying to stop you, just trying to stop mapper heartbreak =D

[Maxunit]

I'm currently working on my own map so far, not much progress tho, because I'm not really into drawing concepts. Lack of skill Most stuff currently is being made with graphical imagination (in my head xD).

I will show some screenies after I have enough progress to show.

[StixNStonz]

You dont need graphical skill to make layout drawings. I made all the drawings for my map from the Minimap perspective; all from the top-down. If you have the idea for the room in your head, then you should be able to plot how it would look on the in-game minimap, and that can really help you figure out the full layout for your map. Its not single rooms that count, its the entire flow and balanced connectivity.